What made everybody move from a corporate social media platform to another corporate social media platform instead of the fediverse?
After all, the Fediverse and Activitypub is much more mature than Bluesky and the copycat AT protocol or Threads and … whatever they use.
Because the Mastodon community did the same thing we do every time there is a chance to get people away from corporations (e.g. Linux vs Windows).
People were looking for an alternative. The general consensus was it was hard to really grok federation. So, of course, The Community insisted on explaining federation and why it was good while basically only commenting on the instances that had closed applications. It was the equivalent of insisting someone who wanted to try Linux for gaming NEEDS to use arch and only needs to know twenty command line operations to get up and running.
So… everyone instead just went to Bluesky and Threads where sign-up links were provided rather than directory links and manifestos.
And… I am perfectly happy with that. Lemmy has a LOT of issues where so much of the community is talking about their ex-girlfriend (reddit) all the time and we basically get constant content and engagement farming that makes no fucking sense considering the userbase.
Whereas Mastodon actually IS a really good community that feels very different from twitter/bluesky/threads. It isn’t for everyone but I very regularly have genuinely good conversations with people in the town hall/microblog format. Whereas… I am not sure if I have ever had even a meaningful conversation on lemmy (whereas I’ve probably had maybe ten on reddit over the years?).
I agree with you, people end up going the perceived “easy route” because of the amount of explaining and low level protocol exposure that they receive from someone who is trying to sell them on joining an ActivityPub network. And that’s just the people who are trying to encourage them to join, then there’s the people that straight up think “normal social media” people don’t belong on the fediverse because of one biased reason or another…
So… everyone instead just went to Bluesky and Threads where sign-up links were provided rather than directory links and manifestos.
Wild! This was my exact thought as I was signing up for Mastadon. I spent like 15 minutes figuring out what Mastadon is, what server to join, what each server means. Then I did the thing like I did with Lemmy and created half a dozen accounts waiting to see which server gave me my “Account Created” email first.
“Everyone”? I know exactly zero people that have admitted to having a Bluesky account, but I know plenty that have an Mastodon etc. one.
I think this is at most a very regional or specific user bubble thing, and official user numbers for these commercial services are never trustworthy.
Too hairy.
the later those outlook, iphone and windows11 using ppl find a good home in a more guarded environment. makes fediverse a place that can grow. it is not mature yet as we all can see when looking at defederation drama. in the end you will be able to choose between the fully federated network or a “super” app like weechat.
for me, it was discoverability. Like, several guides said “use tags” but 4 out of 5 people DON"T. And more often than not, when you do search the tags, you see several posts that aren’t what you wanted at all. Or worse, the tag you search doesn’t have any posts newer than several months to a year. Basically it relied on an honor system where few people had honor.
Threads was because if you had an Instagram account it ported over.
Bluesky was the Twitter clone made by the old Twitter CEO.
Most people didn’t have a problem with Twitter being a corporation, they had a problem with the new owner of the corporation making the experience terrible with his new changes.
Valid question, but Americans in particular are easily swayed by the fact that the corporate ownership is listed as a “Public Benefit Corporation.” Bluesky is a PBC and for most people that’s enough “proof” that they will “be for the public good.”
In that it is set up to “benefit the public good” people just… buy into that, even if the company isn’t actually benefitting the public good.
Look at how long it took for people to wise up that the Susan G. Komen foundation was spending most of its money on their CEOs and ads and very little on actually helping people.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_G._Komen_for_the_Cure#Pinkwashing
For the general public, Open Source generally means “difficult to set up and use with bad user interface.”
And yes, the whole self-hosting thing with numerous servers is confusing to people who have never had to step outside of the corporate-dominated internet.
All that is self-evident based on the original reddit exodus to here on Lemmy. The initial exodus lead to tons of people complaining about lack of features on Lemmy with very few people actually stepping up to contribute to the code-base to bring those features to light. They’re just far too used to private company doing all that “for free” (*cough for all your private data cough) and struggle to understand how the different way it is set up means you don’t get all the fancy features from the get-go.
So people saw an option with corporate sponsorship and money behind it, and they leap to that. Also I’m sure Bluesky is investing in advertising their product, which is competing with zero advertising dollars spend on the no-corporate fediverse.
This is weird on multiple levels, Bluesky code is Open Source, it’s federated and no one gives a damn about it being a PBC. It’s mostly about culture why people have gone to Bluesky and Threads
No, AT is open source, not Bluesky
To be fair, people having ideas for features is a valuable contribution in its own right.
Entitlement to them, not so much. But feature suggestions have value even if many of them aren’t practical and many more never get added.
Agreed, but during the exodus it was less “this is a positive feature that we need and I’m willing to be patient” it was more like:
“This feature not existing is why no one will ever use this product! I’m sick of this and going back to reddit!” after being on Lemmy for 10 fucking minutes.
Oddly enough that secondary exodus is probably why this place is so much more positive
I don’t disagree with your points but I think they apply to pretty specific groups. I doubt that the average person knows or cares that Bluesky is a PBC. The reaction of the average person to ‘open source’ is probably, “I have no idea what that is and please for the love of god don’t explain it to me.”
The initial exodus lead to tons of people complaining about lack of features on Lemmy with very few people actually stepping up to contribute to the code-base to bring those features to light.
Dude…I have zero clue how to use linux. Which I assume is easier than writting code. You think I’m going to write a program in C++ or whatever language?
Saying the users aren’t developing the program is like saying the hospital patients aren’t willing to be their own doctor.
Users will ALWAYS bring up issues, and if the developers want the platform to grow, they’ll implement upgrades to fix those issues.
Otherwise, you just have a userbase that rejects your platform, goes somewhere else, and a small group on the platform wondering why it’s not growing.
Which is basically the core of this post.
Is it really that surprising that large companies with lots of money can advertise better than user run instances of open source software?
Mastodon overwhelmed me. I hopped on the website and had no idea what I was looking at. I didn’t understand federation. I basically had the option of what niche hobby to join on Mastadon and no indication that I would he able to access a broader forum, so I said “Well, this fucking sucks.” and left.
Threads and BlueSky are likely as accessible as making an account and you’re done.
As depressing as it sounds, most Twitter users actually like Twitter. They’re fully okay with all of its dystopian features (some even idolize pre-Musk Twitter). Mastodon is a break from Twitter in many ways, whereas bluesky is just another Twitter in their eyes (many of them probably dgaf about federation and ignore it).
Twitter and YouTube are the least toxic social media platforms I use. I know toxicity exists on both but it is not being served to me. My feed is what I want to see and only that.
On the other hand, something like Reddit or Lemmy needs a huge amount of curation to keep the feed even half decent.
@dch82 mastodon can’t go mainstream because its emphasis on decentralization is too prominent in its communication, which complicates its adoption
However, modern social networks can still stand out, provided that federation is natural and not explicitly mentioned—similar to how Threads operates currently
Threads has close ties with Instagram
(Threads uses opt-out ActivityPub.)
Threads uses opt-out ActivityPub.
That’s not true. I can neither opt my test account in nor out of ActivityPub. It’s simply not available to Mastodon.
Yeah, because your instance and almost all instances have decided to straight-up defederate cuz Meta will access the federated info
I just edited my comment to add a link to the guide for opting in.
Yeah, because your instance and almost all instances have decided to straight-up defederate
No, it didn’t defederate from Threads.
cuz Meta will access the federated info
Meta will access Threads accounts via federation? Um, sure… I mean it’s on their platform already…
I just edited my comment to add a link to the guide for opting in.
“Be outside Europe” is hardly a guide to opt in. 🙄 I’m in Europe and my Threads profile just isn’t available on ActivityPub. Period.
Edit: It’s actually opt-in.
… in certain areas:
Moved here and never looked back.
People dumb.
because mastodon because dismissed twitter users concerns and thoughts the first exodus and bluesky implemented them in a way that’s closer to twitter.
The fediverse has many micro blogging implementations outside of mastodon if you don’t like their featureset (and they federate with each other, unlike bluesky). The only features I couldn’t find are those that contributed to making Twitter the dystopian toxic space that it is.
Using another ActivityPub-based interface is a LOT to ask for many users. They want a simple to pronounce name, they can stick in their browser’s universal bar and be on a sign-up page in less than 3 clicks without making any more choices.
😞
Well I am speaking about users who may be picky about mastodon’s features. If someone is picky, I don’t imagine they’d care much about just finding a platform with their preferred features, similar to how they didn’t like mastodon and found bluesky instead.
… what
There have been some complaints about Mastodon for years; both specific (“quote tweets”) and vague (get rid of shitty, often bigoted replies for profiles with a lot of followers or with a marginalized identity).
Mastodon largely hasn’t implemented them. Maybe Bluesky has. (I don’t have a BS account.)
How was your dentist appointment?
