A friendly reminder that gatekeepers are walking, talking mindrot.
I recall when I was first informed about “cultural appropriation” and how it boiled down to the concept that if a white person enjoys any aspect of a non-white culture it was an act of racism. Gotta love the gravity well of ultra liberal bullshit warping back in on itself and becoming fascism.
That’s a bullshit explanation of cultural appropriation and the person you heard it from is an idiot. Actual cultural appropriation is when you take something from another culture and either erase or overwrite its origin, so the original culture in its original form becomes forgotten.
For example, when white artists re-recorded songs from black artists and specifically removed them from the credits and claimed them as their own, that was cultural appropriation. When movie studios chopped up Indian culture and presented it in a completely distorted and inaccurate light, so much so that the original meanings were lost, that was cultural appropriation.
Simply being a participant in someone else’s cultural celebration is not cultural appropriation.
Considering I’ve seen a lot of gatekeeping morons go on about cultural appropriation without ever mentioning that, I think most don’t understand this crucial distinction.
If you form your understanding on topics you don’t understand based on what “gatekeeping morons” think or do, you are going to be perpetually misinformed
Even though you’re totally wrong with like definitions and facts, I do like your writing and appreciate your poetic license.
This isn’t fascism, this is social conscience.
A lot less severe than what you pretend fascism is.
TBH though I do find the term used to gatekeep far more than I see it used to promote respect. Most cultural arts and traditions formed from bringing a few items/ideas from other cultures back to their own and overtime they incorporated it into their own. Shit like wearing a cultures clothing item that requires significant cultural acts to obtain in said culture when you are not a patt of it, theres nuance and issues of cultural respect to talk about there. But “cultural appropriation” as a term doesnt really get used that often with that level of nuance
I mostly disagree, every time I visited a country and wore the cultural dress, the local culture has been very supportive and appreciative, and I’ve been able to enter into more interesting conversations because I’m willing to engage in their culture on a more visceral level.
I understand cultural sensitivity, but I have yet to encounter a culture that does not want to be recognized, particularly for their notable and impressive achievements.
Or if their clothing looks f****** cool, like in Morocco or Japan. China. Or the states. Or Vietnam. Or Germany(goofy but still fun). Malaysia.
Everywhere. Everywhere I have talked to people, they appreciate the appreciation of their culture.
Thats… kinda what I’m talking about? Cultural appropriation is most often used in a context of why you SHOULDNT engage in things you like about another culture
You’re condemning the appreciation of another culture, which every culture will tell you is welcome and appreciated.
So it is kind of what you’re talking about, except you’re missing the main point.
IM not condemning the appreciation of other cultures. I’m saying the concept of Cultural Appropriation leads to the thought process of the woman who’s tweet started this thread more than it leads to how to be better respectful in how you appreciate things. A person wouldnt “appopriate” anything unless something about it found interest in them. Just general lessons in respect in general are far more useful
Idk wtf “a person wouldn’t appropriate anything unless something about it found interest in them” means, so I’m going to just assume that your heart is in the right place.
Happy New Year
To me, the term “cultural appropriation” refers to things like schools having kids make chicken feather “headdresses” to “celebrate” Native American Day, or wearing a religious symbol in a disrespectful way. Even though people like the person in the post can be annoying, I think it’s still progress that we’re able to have these discussions, and I think it’s too bad that for many people the takeaway seems to be “cultural appropriation is never problematic.” I’d take the person from the post any day over someone who thinks they’re immune from criticism when they unintentionally engage in behavior that truly is disrespectful.
No goddamn way.
We’ve been having these discussions, as far as history is aware, since we started writing things down.
Give me the rebuttal friend any day.
I’ve been to too many countries, and what you’re alleging is simply and practically incorrect.
Cultures appreciate genuine cultural appreciation.
But cultural appreciation is not what is meant by “cultural appropriation.” Cultural appropriation is when it’s done in a disrespectful manner.
I grew up with some utterly racist experiences in school – the feather “headdress” and cardboard tipis, the sombreros on Cinco de Mayo, etc.
I wish I’d had someone at the time to explain why that was wrong.
That’s ignorance, which is different from any sort of intentional disrespect.
You get a pass，as a kid.
You’re going to ask, how do I know you’re getting a pass?
Go ask anybody from the culture you’re afraid of offending if you get a pass for being a child.
It’ll be cool.
“Gatekeep”, “gaslight” they’ve become twitter shit words. Completely poisoned. Just mentionning them cast doubt and suspicion on the speaker. Even when it applies.
I mean, thats essentially what I’m arguing about with the word Cultural Appropriation
Gotta love the gravity well of ultra liberal bullshit warping back in on itself and becoming fascism.
Racist fascism in the guise of anti-racist inclusion.
It’s not any form of liberalism. The troll depicted in the original post, is building a strawman. A ridiculous opinion nobidy believes. The goal is simple to delegitimise the whole idea of cultural appropriation. To basically say, Disney did nothing wrong taking children’s public domain folklore and locking it behind an intellectual property paywall for 100 years.
That’s the real goal here. As usual the powerful taking away from the weak and saying they’re not allowed to complain.
You are ultimately right, this is fasch behaviour. This is fasch wearing fake liberal faceskin.
Sorry to inform you, but I know people like this, and they’re not building strawmen or false flags. They sincerely think they’re helping, when all they’re doing is creating strife and division.
I think it’s malicious and they know what they’re doing. They don’t like the idea so they push it to the ridiculous extreme. Or, they’re another form of malicious, the busybody intruder who wants to tell others how to live and pretending this is about the “victim” are simply using those “victims” as to justify their aggression.
That ratio lol
Friendly reminder that nearly everyone on Twitter are fuckheads.
I just call them “twits”.
It’s x now, they are xhits.
HangonletmecheckokayIseewhatyoumean.
Friendly reminder that nearly everyone on
Twitterthe Internet are fuckheads.wait wait wait, but I’m on the internet! :o
Fuckhead
that an offer, or…?
One of us, one of us!
Friendly reminder that nearly everyone on
Twitter the Internetthe planet are fuckheads.
I’m gonna celebrate like there’s no tomorrow. What can you do?
I invite everyone here to Pancake Day on Tuesday :)
The hero we never knew we needed
THANKYOU
I work. Can we do it today?
I’m Jewish. I invite you all to celebrate any Jewish holiday. But they’re all stupid religious bullshit other than the food part, so I wouldn’t bother.
Judaism is a closed religion, lighting candles for Hanukkah is one thing and that’s cool if you want to partake in some fun. Saying prayers over those candles is markedly different and definitely appropriation.
I wouldn’t call it appropriation. Appropriation would be claiming those weren’t Jewish prayers or a menorah, they were Christian (or whatever).
A non-Jew saying Hebrew prayers doesn’t offend me. My non-Jewish wife has done it before because she got a masters in folklore and wanted to take part. She didn’t claim it as her own, she just took part in the ceremony. And plenty of non-Jewish spouses of Jews have done the same thing.
Honestly, if you’re curious and you want to take part in Jewish ceremonies, go for it. Judaism is not as closed as you think. If it was, you wouldn’t have famous converts like Sammy Davis, Jr. and Isla Fisher (and Ivanka Trump, unfortunately). It’s not a simple process like turning around three times and saying “I’m a Jew!” but it’s not exactly a ridiculous challenge either.
A non Jew saying Jewish prayers is absolutely appropriation. There’s a rather clear line of thinking surrounding this in the greater Jewish community especially amongst the rabbinical crowd, and the Messianics are a rather large part of it.
Rabbis aren’t popes. They don’t get to decide what is or is not offensive to Jews in general. Sure, very religious Jews might have a problem with it. And I could not care less what they think. Especially when they’re the minority in the U.S.
62% of self-described American Jews say being Jewish is mainly a matter of ancestry and culture, while just 15% say it is mainly a matter of religion. Even among Jews by religion, 55% say being Jewish is mainly a matter of ancestry and culture, while 66% say it is not necessary to believe in God to be Jewish.[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_atheism
Do you honestly think most Jews would have a big problem with my wife saying a blessing over the menorah when most of them don’t even think you have to believe in a god? I guarantee you more Jews were offended by Bradley Cooper playing Leonard Bernstein with a prosthetic nose than they would be over a non-Jew saying a Hebrew prayer.
Rabbi’s aren’t Pope’s and they’re born to argue so when the vast majority of them clearly state that a non Jew saying Jewish prayers is contrary to the principles of the religion then I’m going to accept that as a religious decree.
So yea your non jewish wife saying the bracha is a problem. You’re welcome to practice as you see fit, no one’s going to pull your Jew card over it but that doesn’t make it halacha/Kosher/ cool or any other version of acceptable.
Why do Rabbis get to declare what is cultural appropriation when only 15% of American Jews say Judaism is about religion?
It sounds like you are offended by it. I would love some evidence that the general Jewish population agrees with you.
Why do the people who devote their lives to studying the scriptures of the religion get to be the ones who decide what’s acceptable within the religion and what’s not?
Because they’re literally the subject matter experts. It’s also pretty damn clear in the tanach too. In order to perform the mitzvah you need to be Jewish.
I’m not offended by how you choose to practice your religion, I’m pointing out that what you’re doing is absolutely cultural appropriation and off sides with the understood practice of the religion as a whole. You’re the one who seems to be offended by being called out on this, and that’s for you to come to grips with not me.
Yeah, but… the food part.
Eh, you can have charoset any day of the year if you feel like it.
Food holidays are my favorite holidays, and also because of Jon Stewart, I irrationally appreciate the abundance of Jewish holidays.
Which Jewish holidays should I celebrate?
Well the problem is that Passover has the best food, but it’s also celebrating a genocide, so I don’t really have a good recommendation.
Purim maybe? It’s mildly less stupid than the others since it’s actually based on something that really happened? But it’s still based on an arranged marriage, so even that’s kind of fucked up. I don’t know. The Bible is ridiculous.
Dang, yea, the Bible is a terrible mess.
The food is the best part of any holiday, to be fair.
I agree. Unfortunately, with Jewish holidays, you have to sit through what feels like about 10 hours of prayers in Hebrew before you get to the food.
Which especially sucks when you’re a hungry kid who doesn’t understand Hebrew.
I dated a girl who is Jewish many years ago. Her parents would just throw dishes at each other while arguing in Hebrew. To hear you say that it can’t be entertaining slightly offends me.
Hebrew or Yiddish? If she wasn’t Israeli, it was probably Yiddish. Yiddish is also better for yelling people in. My grandmother was very good at it. It’s like if German had a bastard child with Polish.
where does ladino fit into this?
Not very much. There are very few Ladino speakers alive today. Like exponentially fewer than Yiddish, which already doesn’t have very many speakers left.
Ladino is very close to Medieval Spanish, but written using Hebrew letters.
Oh maybe that’s what it was. On a related note the girl I dated has a sister that was a substitute teacher at our high school at the time. She was 21 and would buy us booze and she also played strip poker with my friends and me. Took my buddy’s virginity. Fun times!
I have the best Jewish friends. They’re not strict Jewish, they adapt a lot of the traditions to suit themselves. For example any of the food heavy holiday’s they invite their non-Jewish friends over but do most of the religious stuff before we show up. So for me, I get to visit with friends, eat pretty good food (I’ve learned what to avoid like the unleavened bread), and help them celebrate something that’s important to them. They make no expectation for us to actually participate, just respect that they are. It’s a good time.
I feel for their kids though, they have to do the 10 hour thing.
Damn, lucky you not having to sit through the boring shit. Because yeah, the food is great!
Yep. Half my family is Jewish, half is Catholic. My dad (Jewish atheist) made me sit through a really long seder once and afterward said he forgot how boring they are. And also didn’t warn me about the bitter herbs lol. Next time we went to a seder it was wayyy more streamlined.
You can use parsley as ‘bitter herbs,’ which is what we did. Not the most pleasant thing to eat, but not exactly unpalatable. I’ve heard of some people using celery. That feels like cheating.
If fish isn’t meat to the Catholics then why shouldn’t celery be a bitter herb
Beaver, armadillo, alligator and capybara are all also fish according to the Catholic church.
So yeah, Jews definitely don’t have the monopoly on this stuff.
Celery leaves specifically would probably be what they meant. You can actually use them as a substitute for parsley in cooking!
I think that may be what the idea was, but they definitely meant just regular celery because the conversation, which had happened a couple of times with guests when I was a kid, was along the lines of “why are you using parsley? Celery is so much nicer!”
Hamantaschen are amazing and I’ll make them year round, no one can stop me!
I also make the donuts for Hanukkah for my mother
At least we’re out of the years where we were making like a gross of them. That was exhausting.
Every year my mother buys jelly donuts for us when we come to visit for Hanukkah and every year, we all tell her that we don’t like jelly donuts.
At least she doesn’t try to cook them. She’s an awful cook. And she doesn’t understand food. She makes latkes in the oven (not fried) the day before we come, freezes them, then defrosts them when we come over. And we eat two and pretend we like them and cover them with enough sour cream so that we can’t taste them.
We used to go home and make our own another day, but they’re also kind of a pain in the ass to make, so we just deal with shitty latkes once a year now.
Her matzoh ball soup is fine, but it’s very hard to fuck that up.
Oh, the homemade donuts, all 122 of them were well received! As well as the hamantaschen. But when you’re making a gross of them, it just takes a long time.
I like latkes, but it was one of them few holiday cooking things that I did not get pushed into doing as a kid (and now several decades later still do for the family)
Challah, hamantaschen, donuts…mostly all the dessert things, I guess. And the charoset! There’s more, but I forget until I get the call and start baking for her.
I’m good with most Jewish food, but I draw the line at gefilte fish. I don’t know who decided ground up fish balls in soup was a good idea, but it wasn’t.
That’s fucking adorable though. Getting old is weird.
hi fellow Jew pls celebrate the holidays with me
Our white versions don’t involve the food :(
There’s plenty of Jewish food cookbooks out there! I’m personally a big fan of kugel.
My (fairly religious) aunt introduced me to latkes when I was a kid and it became a lifelong love affair.
I love a good latke, but a bad latke is a very sad thing indeed.
She was (is) a great cook, they were always light and fluffy. Usually we’d have them with applesauce but sometimes she’d make them with a lot of onion and we’d eat them with ketchup.
Ew. I don’t know about ketchup. We always have sour cream.
I love my aunt and have very fond memories of oniony, ketchupy latkes but I don’t eat ketchup with my potatos anymore lol.
In my defense, I was a child. I’m not even sure where she came across them, we’re not Jewish (we were Baptists, from the midwest).
She also makes an onion pie that’s pretty great.
Christ that looks good.
It’s also so easy to make that even my mother can’t fuck it up. Which, if you ever had my mother’s attempts at cooking, is very impressive.
Lmao. Does her cooking make you nostalgic?
My mom regrets that she didn’t learn all of her mother’s cajun recipes. I regret it, too.
It does not. She’s a much better cook than when I was a kid while still being a terrible cook. But at least her idea of offering me dinner is no longer a defrosted turkey burger every night.
There were also the dreaded dinnertime words of my childhood: “This was an experiment.”
Because the “experiment” was usually something like, “the recipe called for two cups of sugar and that’s too much sugar, so I substituted cottage cheese.”
That sounds horrendous. Kind of adorable, though.
It’s chinese new year? Why they call it lunar year? Yes I know their calendar is running by the moon. Is “lunar year” ultra-woke to avoid a “ugly” word like “chinese”? An other case of woke racism?
It’s celebrated in many Asian countries, so calling it lunar New Year is a simple way to not group them all as Chinese.
No racism, just accuracy.
It’s more because so many cultures have a lunar calendar, so even though China is the largest population that uses the lunar calendar, it’s not precise to just call it the Chinese New Year, since so many countries and cultures also have a lunar calendar.
Sorry, today it’s New Year in the Chinese Calendar. It’s celebrated by Chinese all over the world. And it’s not even a really “lunar” calendar. More precise is to call it a “lunar-solar” calendar. Racism, not accuracy.
We agree; all of the stuff you’re saying is just racism, not accuracy.
Who is “we”? Cancel Culture! Haha.
Definitely! Haha, let’s cancel your personal culture(shouldn’t be difficult with the minimal amount of culture you possess)!
Also, I guess Yolo, that seems in your wheelhouse.
Happy New Chinese Year!
Thanks! Inaccurate, but consistent with your line of reasoning.
Cultural appropriation hater VS Cultural sharing enjoyer
Nothing friendly about gatekeeping, it’s just a patronizing way to be a giant fucking bitch no one wants to be around.
Not every “lunar new year” is on the same day in every country; there are different lunar calendars.
The Chinese New Year is not the Buddhist New Year is not the Islamic New Year, yet we’re smashing them all together.
This is cultural insensitivity.
No it isn’t?
China, Korea, Vietnam, Malaysia, lots of countries use lunar calendars that arrive on the same date.
Calling it the lunar New Year is not a cultural sensitivity, it’s simple accuracy.
Even countries that use the same calendar don’t call it the same thing!
Korea and Vietnam each have their own Korean and Vietnamese New Years, but Malaysia literally calls it Tahun Baru Cina (I’ll give you three guesses what Cina means). In fact, several countries call it something like that: Singapore and the Philippines calls it the Chinese New Year, Brunei calls it Tahun Baru Cina, etc. Meanwhile, China doesn’t even call it a lunar new year, they call it the spring festival.
Lumping them all together is just something we’re doing to make it easier for Americans.
Korea, Malaysia, and Singapore don’t call it the same name because they speak different languages, but they do not all call it Chinese New Year in real life, no matter what your Google Fu says.
I’m speaking to this from China right now, saying Happy New Year every 10 minutes. China is one of the countries with a literal lunar calendar.
Lunar New Year is perfectly accurate, and more accurate than “Chinese New Year”.
My Korean is terrible, but when I was there they all said sollal, the local name of the lunar New Year holiday.
Vietnam was easier because the lunar New Year is called the pronounceable “tet.”
Malaysia, Singapore, they have local names for the lunar New Year that don’t include the word China.
You’re really hunting for these “Chinese New Year” names that are in practice uncommon or disused.
You can call it that if you want to, but you’ll just be that old grandma in the meme with the hospice worker assuring you that everything is fine and she can escort you back to 4chan.
In fact, please go to any of the countries you’ve mentioned, or Singapore or the Philippines and tell them that you’re celebrating Chinese New Year and report back their response.
Especially the Philippines, they don’t brook no s*** hahaha.
The “tahun baru cina” thing used in Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia and Brunei isn’t uncommon or disused btw. It’s the term used by the native Malay population because Malay is the official language in those countries. A term not used by the cultures celebrating this lunar new year.
I have not heard that term during the lunar New Year, and I’ve heard people say Happy New Year in Malaysia hundreds of times.
If you’re a native Malay, I will take your word for it that your particular village(which village are you from ?) is peculiar, since that is not the common national phrase.
You don’t sound like a native malay.
You have way too many native English joinders to be a Malay.
Are you searching Google for any international phrase that connects to China so that you’re not completely wrong about this, even though you were completely wrong about this?
she says while wearing clothes made in said countries typing the message on a device also made overseas.
Nah, as a cracker ass American I think I will celebrate Lunar New Year and immerse myself in the lore and customs of people I share this plant with because history rocks my fucking socks.
F*** yeah. Happy February 10th and Happy New Year!
Fuck yeah I love this plant
Wat? This is so stupid it actually causes me physical pain. That’s like telling anyone who’s not a Christian they can’t celebrate Christmas. 🙄
I think this should be reinforced. If your name isn’t Christian then you can’t celebrate Christmas :(
I think if your name is Jesus you get to celebrate it
Or anyone who is, considering it’s not a Christian holiday by origin
Chinatowns and Mayors of metropolitan cities with Chinatowns : Here’s the schedule of Lunar new year celebrations, come along and enjoy the culture!
This gatekeeping idiot :
