But their tolerance for making you suffer differs significantly.
well to be fair %100 republicans and about %90 of democrats don’t give a shit about you
Bernie is an Independent, so it’s more like 95
The problem of the US is, it is an neo-liberal feudalism with the right to vote between right wing and far right wing to be able to label it as democracy which it never really was. You have the choice to get fucked with or without lubrication, currently the last one.
Honestly, I read this thread and can’t comprehend how a civilization as advanced as the United States of America thinks that defending a binary choice of democracy is a good thing to do… It’s impossible to represent a country with a few million people like that, imagine ~300M. Anyway, keep going at each other’s throats for your party color… smh.
It’s not an advanced civilization, they have slavery enshrined in constitution.
What part of the Constitution are you referring to?
13th Amendment I assume. Slavery is allowed as punishment for any crime.
…huh, I haven’t noticed that…
I don’t blame you, I was educated that it abolished slavery. But there’s a very big “except”. It was partially added to help sway the Confederate states to make them happy that they can keep slaves if they find enough things to arrest them for.
It’s part of why Jim Crow laws happened. And it’s exactly why America has the highest amount of people in jail than any other nation. Slaves are cheap labor.
“indentured servitude” is the euphemism they use.
Obviously the bestest democracy in the history of the entire universe doesn’t have slavery.
deleted by creator
Finally someone who speaks the truth, however humans are a lost case, you can’t un-slave mentality without changing the people.
funniest comment section of all time. my country truly will never change for the better.
I, John Brown, am now quite certain, that the crimes of this guilty land will never be purged away, but with blood.
He did know that already in 1859
Useless line of thinking. Go do something about it.
That doesn’t even make sense. If it’s useless thinking, then why do anything about it?
looks like the lib programming on that one has a few screws loose
The funniest thing about non Americans is that they think most of us don’t fucking know this. It’s so annoying
Read the comments in the thread. Americans dont know this lmao
This thread is very clearly proving that US liberals actually think they live in a democracy.
If you read this thread you can clearly see that Americans, not known for their shrewdness or ability to read, don’t actually fucking know this.
This “both sides” is bullshit when you are getting a train run on you by the Republicans…
You really don’t get it, huh?
People heard that shit last time, and they voted democrat, and Biden won. And ABSOLUTELY NOTHING changed.
At the end of the day, the rich got richer and the poor got poorer, just like they did with trump, and with Obama, and with every single president who has taken office in god knows how many decades.
And still you’re here yapping “oh noes the horrors, vote Dems”.
Bro, the Dems aren’t LISTENING! Get a Bernie up there, or an AOC, or anyone that the people actually believe will do anything other than feeding the same interests they have been feeding.
And if you’re too thick to realize that, at least you’re not alone, the whole DNC is right there with you.
Are you denying that the Dems are shit? Just because the Reps are worse and currently in power?
What kind of an argument is that supposed to be?
What are you talking about the initial argument is completely insane to be begin with. I think Biden came into office and reduce child poverty or hunger or something by half as his first action.
We’re gonna compare that to Trump destroying the economy, removing due process, open up national parks to logging, letting DOGE cut departments with corruption, invading other countries?
Lol, while technically true there’s a big picture you’re missing… The start of his presidency did co-incide with some things like the child tax credit etc. that did drop the official measurement to a historic low of 5.2% in 2021, but was then quickly repealed by bipartisan support in Congress causing it to skyrocket to 12.4% in 2022.
In the US the child poverty rate had been slowly, but steadily, declining since the peak of the great recession… Until the Biden presidency circa ~2022 at which point it skyrocketed by the end of his presidency reaching ~2012 levels.
While technically true that “Biden came into office and reduce[d] child poverty [sic] by half as his first action.” It ignores that immediately afterwards he did “destroy the economy”. Don’t get me started on ‘removing due process, open up national parks, cutting departments with corruption, invading other countries’ because also yes!
Not to say Trump is better (we can all agree fuck that guy and all his cronies), but Jim Crow Joe is/was also evil, you’ve just been tricked into thinking otherwise…
Thanks for replying, I just recalled this:
Now we can say he failed but I can’t say that specific act is evil. Palestine on the other hand … ☠️
Like, I get your viewpoints and you guys think I’m trying to bury any negative viewpoints of the democratic party or that I’m brainwashed. Which is funny to me because I hate the establishment Dems. I just think posts saying both suck and attacking the Dems aren’t helpful because they currently have no power. The other party is causing a lot of damage and there seems to be no stopping them so kicking the feckless Dems when they’re down seems weird to me.
I also think the democratic party needs to be ousted by progressive candidates that have a good vision for the future. I’m not gonna lie though I don’t see it happening. The establishment Dems aren’t gonna bow down. Also, I see so many protests happening and although AOC and Bernie have made the news I don’t think I see the Dem leadership taking advantage of this and putting up a solid front either, like wtf is going on? I’m not sure it’s the coverage but it really seems like they’re lost.
The difference is the viewpoint:
attacking the Dems aren’t helpful because they currently have no power. The other party is causing a lot of damage and there seems to be no stopping them
If you buy into the underlying premises of how a liberal democracy functions (liberal used here as a technical term, not as a perjorative) then the only ones who have the power to stop the other party is the Dems and they actively choose not to. They’re neither down, nor out they’re doing their job of controlled opposition exactly as they are supposed to.
I still don’t like saying how they’re both the same because I fundamentally don’t believe that to my core (ie if they had all three branches we wouldn’t be talking about all this current mayhem).
However, I think I understand your point and I agree with it.
So thanks again!
They aren’t the same, one’s a sword and one’s a shield. The shield can’t effectively stab, but the sword can’t either if it’s forced to parry instead.
I engaged because it seemed like there was agreement, just miscommunication. Glad I was able to help cut through it :D. Appreciate you!
What are you talking about the initial argument is completely insane to be begin with. I think Biden came into office and reduce child poverty or hunger or something by half as his first action.
Are you having a stroke? I don’t follow your point and/or syntax.
We’re gonna compare that to Trump destroying the economy, removing due process, open up national parks to logging, letting DOGE cut departments with corruption, invading other countries?
What do you want from me? Obviously we agree that Trump is worse than the Dems.
That still doesn’t make the Dems “not bad”.
Nobody said the Dems were perfect OR not bad through the chain.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_equivalence - is what this post is.
Nobody said the Dems were perfect OR not bad through the chain.
Never claimed that someone claimed that. Again: how is the original post wrong?
Two parties in a two party system is no case of “apples and oranges”. That’s as close to a fair comparison as you’re gonna get.
Ghonorrea and pancreatic cancer are two things I don’t want to have. Is this “false equivalency” as well?
Two parties in a two party system is no case of “apples and oranges”. That’s as close to a fair comuarison as yo’'re gonna get
stroke much?
seriously, this isn’t a “fair comparison” because it doesn’t address any sort of nuance nor is it supposed to. It’s supposed to make people go: “yeah the dems suck too” rather than understand anything about what’s going on.
If you claim to be on the same page then whatever, we can just agree on our core points leave it at that.
stroke much?
I guess you never make typos, then. Huh? /s
seriously, this isn’t a “fair comparison” because it doesn’t address any sort of nuance nor is it supposed to.
I’m sorry that I slandered ghonorrea by comparing it to pancreatic cancer. Clearly I forgot the nUaNcE between these two horrible sicknesses. /s
Wait. How can there be any “nuance” if you can’t compare the two parties? Is a comparison of apples with oranges flawed because of the “nuance”?
It’s supposed to make people go: “yeah the dems suck too” rather than understand anything about what’s going on.
That’s what you think the intent is. I think that it’s supposed to state that the US democratic system is not suitable for a fair and equitable world and the Dems are not the solution of the mess the US is in.
You can have your own interpretation but don’t assume that this was OP’s intent.
Biden gleefully engaged in one of the worst genocides of the era. He should be in a cell in the Hague.
I agree I think it’s fucking horrible and I think Chuck Schumer and everyone on any side of the political aisle that upheld this should be in a jail cell too.
And the leader of the Democrats describes his job as “keeping the left pro Israel”.
Correct, but still not even close to the same thing. More of this “balanced” stuff.
Anywho on the plus side, he’s getting wrecked in the polls vs AOC who’s looking to take his place though.
Genocide apologist
I’m an Independent. But there’s no “leader” of the Democrats, it’s a big-tent party. Chuck is head of the group of Democratic senators, but he doesn’t dictate things outside of Senate business and we don’t blindly all follow everything he says. That’s the difference between electing public servants and people in a cult.
EDIT: Downvote all you want, this is a simple fact. You’re allowed to just want to be mad! But I don’t know why people click the “down” button just because they don’t like what was said… Has anyone used actual logic and facts to disprove me? Of course not…
The only time Democrats won’t fall in line is when they have to vote for Republican budget bills.
After the train run on you by democrats…
I can’t deal with US politics right now and this thread.
I’m fucking Canadian and people upvoting this both sides nonsense is getting my blood boiling.
I thought this enlightened centrist shit was over with but people are bringing it up like they’re some next-level IQ genius. When in reality they’re trying their to push people to the right (whether they understand it or not).
I’m fucking Canadian
So you probably dont even understand the full context of what you’re talking about.
Arent there other countries political websites you can go bother people on? Try Australia, your fellow commonwealth country (sorry australians). Theres plenty of other places to be a touriust with strong opinions about other peoples governments.
What does you being Canadian have to do with anything?
When is your country going to return the land they stole to its indigenous peoples? When is the US democratic party going to stop supporting the genocide of Palestine?
If its people not voting for the US democratic party, rather than either of the above issues that “gets your blood boiling”, you might need to re-evaluate which side of the white supremacist line you’re on.
whether they understand it or not
If such a thing can be done without understanding, how do you know that you aren’t the one who has been pushed to the right and that you aren’t doing the work of dragging others along with you?
Interesting.
Obama dropped an average of 80 bombs per day on the ME and North Africa during his presidency. The number of civilians murdered is impossible to calculate.
For a USAmerican(or any other person), their primary concern would be their own safety, right?
Unless they can form/support a major third party, they are effectively forced to a two-choice system
Choosing not to participate in the two choice system is how you get a third choice btw
When both choices explicitely lead to mass murder its mandatory for any ethical person to do all they can to make some third outcome happen.
Voting quietly for what may be slightly less mass murder but certainly is still mass murder is a pathetic and shameful way to chart a course forward. A handful of us have more dignity than that.
Choosing not to participate is how you become dominated by one of the parties, possibly the one you like the least. The way to actually be able to participate is by trying to change the system itself. By that I mean changing First Past the Post voting in each state, as this is the means through which other political parties would be able to spring up. Another option is to run for government yourself as an actor for change within one of the major political parties.
Make no mistake, changing the system is possible. Alaska and Maine have both done it already. Other states can do it too. I think trying alternative voting systems such as ranked robin voting, STAR voting, score voting, or even ranked choice voting would be a major step towards other political parties and to move away from the most the least liked candidates winning elections.
I’m not sure why this was voted down, real lasting solutions require hard work and organizing to make change. Mind you, changing the system of how we vote alone isn’t the end step, but a starting place for change.
The USA is not the world, and its citizens should start looking towards the welfare of the people their country murders.
True
bUt iT’s bEtTeR WhEn dEmOcRaTs aRe iN CoNtRoL BeCaUsE ThErE’s nO FaCiSm!1!1
I learned from looking at this thread logged out on lemmy.ml that libs would prefer a single party state. I must mean they finally see the Chinese point of view LOL
they’re kool aide drinking themselves into a single party state. lol
Will you still be saying that when you’re in a camp for talking shit about the government? Probably not.
no one is; but there are plenty of people who insist that the democrats are better because they dump a little bit less shit on you than the republicans while refusing to admit that shit piles up no matter how little you do it.
Less shit sure sounds better than more.
When I have the luxury of choosing no shit, I do.
Seriously the people in this subreddit cannot seem to comprehend that “less bad” is in fact better than “more bad”
of course it sounds better; the democrat’s entire schtick is sounding better, but substantively the same.
I think if you pay attention you can see that while both aren’t great, one of them is worse.
no one’s arguing that one isn’t worse; but there are plenty of people who keep regurgitating this deflecting talking point and that makes it clear thorough the indoctrination has become.
One wants to put us all in concentration camps, the other doesn’t. Hmmm, let’s go with the psycho narcissist concentration option. Gee, I hope it works out for us.
It’s better when Democrats are in control because my brown countrymen aren’t being detained and deported without due process by Democrat politicians
Yes, but Americans hating their government is exactly what got us here.
Doubling down on that sentiment is only going to make things worse.
You understand that, right?
Hating the government is right and good. The problem is the crushing of the left, the popular front, and the Democrats taking up all space for opposition to the Republicans, while wanting to be “polite Republicans” and maintaining the status quo above all else is what gave opening for hating the government to take this reactionary form.
Nah, you don’t hate your government nearly enough
Well, you expect your hate to create for you a few comrades, but it’ll only make for more hillbillies named Conrad.
Cute, but maybe the classist stuff isn’t actually a clever tool.
You know why they’re called red necks?
Lack of criticism of the US government in the first place is what got us here. You can say the GOP is worse all you want but you must admit that the Democrats are massive fuck ups too if you want things to ever get better.
You can’t keep falling for this notion of “every criticism of the democrats is supporting the GOP”. Its not even an election year for Christ’s sake.
I’m not an American. I hate your government and it hates you.
In fact some of them hate you and consider you to be a parasite no matter what you do.
