• Doomsider@lemmy.world
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    4 hours ago

    This is extremely wrong. The government is most definitely our society. Trying to pretend the government is not made up of us is ridiculous and reeks of othering.

    I have read several of your posts and they all rely on government bad private sector good methodology. It reminds me of good old fashioned anti-government propaganda pushed by corpo bootlickers.

    The government is and always will be a tool of society. I can certainly appreciate your apprehension with our current government in the US. I also appreciate your diligence in defining the difference between public and private spaces.

    • futatorius@lemm.ee
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      15 minutes ago

      Trying to pretend the government is not made up of us is ridiculous and reeks of othering.

      Oh, the incoming US government is made up of us? There is no “us” that includes both me and those thieving, murderous, lying pieces of shit.

      And as the man said, if my thought-dreams could be seen, they’d probably put my head in a guillotine.

    • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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      2 hours ago

      The government is most definitely our society.

      That’s absolutely not true. To use a sports analogy (any sport), the government is the referees, and society is the culture around the game (cheers, rituals, etc). If nobody shows up to the stadium, the refs have nothing to referee, yet society carries on.

      We try to set up rules that match the values we hold (i.e. no dangerous tackles), but if we try to rig the game in our favor, the other team will use those same rules against us. If we give the referees too much leeway in interpreting the rules, we open ourselves up to bribery and unfair game calling.

      As you rightly said, government is a tool of society, but it’s also a dangerous tool. The same tool can guarantee equal protection under the law like the civil rights movement in the US, or it can guarantee unequal protection like in Nazi Germany. The difference comes down to what powers we let the government have.

      First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a socialist.

      Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a trade unionist.

      Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew.

      Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

      You can throw “fascists” (general term for the right wing these days it seems) in there as well. Once you give the government power to regulate speech, it becomes very easy to abuse. If you can control the narrative, you can hold on to power.

      they all rely on government bad private sector good methodology

      While I do most closely align with libertarians than either major party (who are stereotypically pro-private sector), I don’t think this is a good summary. I think government is a dangerous tool and we should be very careful in using it to solve problems. However, I also think large corporations are also dangerous, and we should have tools to keep them in check. For example:

      • rescind corporate protections for larger orgs - if a company is worth more than a certain amount, it no longer needs public protection and should be expected to carry insurance for any debts
      • expose executives to criminal prosecution
      • set strict limits on election interference, and get money out of elections
      • I believe in NIT, a formulation of UBI that has less sticker shock, so people can walk way with confidence from bad employment situations

      We absolutely need checks on both the private and public sectors, the first to prevent any one individual or group from having an outsized influence, and the second to prevent weaponization of the state’s monopoly on force. I believe government should be decentralized, but powerful in the limited roles it has.

      • futatorius@lemm.ee
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        14 minutes ago

        If they’d come for the Nazis first, the remainder of that over-repeated list would not matter.