Neither the shells included in the 'Czech plan' announced this winter, nor those tied to US aid approved at the end of April, have reached the front line, undermining the morale of Ukrainian troops.

I guess nobody explained to them that the west is now deindustrialized and doesn’t have the capacity to produce munitions in the numbers this proxy war requires.

  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP
    87·
    6 months ago

    I’m not sure why you think the goal was to hurt the west. The goal is to stop western sponsored regime in Ukraine from doing ethnic cleansing. What’s hurting Ukrainians is the fact that the west refuses to let this proxy war end. Another big reason for the war happens to be NATO expansion. Here’s Stoltenberg openly admitting why the war started:

    The background was that President Putin declared in the autumn of 2021, and actually sent a draft treaty that they wanted NATO to sign, to promise no more NATO enlargement. That was what he sent us. And was a pre-condition for not invade Ukraine. Of course we didn’t sign that.

    The opposite happened. He wanted us to sign that promise, never to enlarge NATO. He wanted us to remove our military infrastructure in all Allies that have joined NATO since 1997, meaning half of NATO, all the Central and Eastern Europe, we should remove NATO from that part of our Alliance, introducing some kind of B, or second class membership. We rejected that.

    https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/opinions_218172.htm

    I’ve given you lots of resources and background in this thread, but it seems like you’re not actually interested in understanding why the war is happening, and just keep repeating the same talking point.

    • andyburke@fedia.io
      35·
      6 months ago

      You said it was a proxy war. So it is Putin vs. the west. But I am still not clear on how it’s ok to shoot your neighbors to hurt people on the other side of the planet.

      • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP
        73·
        6 months ago

        I’ve explained this as clearly as humanely possible, and if it’s still not clear to you then it’s pretty clear that you intentionally don’t want to understand what’s happening.

        • andyburke@fedia.io
          35·
          6 months ago

          Putin could pull back from Ukraine right now and stop killing Ukrainians, right?

          Couldn’t he fight the west somewhere else instead of killing his neighbors?

          Ukraine didn’t invade Russia, it was the other way around.

          • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP
            71·
            6 months ago

            Please read what I wrote above and then respond to the point I made instead of regurgitating the phrases you memorized.

            • andyburke@fedia.io
              25·
              6 months ago

              Nah, I’ve succeeded in what I set out to do.

              Pretty sure we both know why there is a war in UA and who is responsible.

              • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP
                61·
                6 months ago

                If what you set out to do was to regurgitate propaganda points you’ve memorized, then you’ve accomplished that admirably. 👏

                • andyburke@fedia.io
                  23·
                  6 months ago

                  One country can end the war today. It’s that easy to know who’s fault all of this is.

                  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP
                    61·
                    6 months ago

                    You’re right. US can stop funding its proxy war against Russia any time. Meanwhile, Stoltenberg very explicitly explained whose fault it is, pretty sure he’s got no reason to lie about it. I think I’ll believe the head of NATO over you little buddy.

      • Mongostein@lemmy.ca
        23·
        5 months ago

        If you read their comments in a Russian accent they make way more sense