Depending on where we look, the universe is expanding at different rates. Now, scientists using the James Webb and Hubble space telescopes have confirmed that the observation is not down to a measurement error.
All that I know is that the questions are wonderful and it’s the only thing in life that never gets boring.
YES - THIS IS IT!!! Like, whether we have free will or not, I do not know,(but as we mentioned, it doesn’t even matter b/c either way we need to act as if we do) but whether we SHOULD have free will is something that we could answer… if we knew for certain that there was an external entity. Star Trek is famous for exploring this. Like even if the actual Zeus did exist (they never met him iirc but Kirk did run into Apollo/Mercury at some point…), what “claim” would he have over humanity? Same with Arthur C. Clarke’s (2001 A Space Odyssey) saga: just b/c they gave us our start (into sentience, or even seeding DNA & thus life itself?) doesn’t necessarily mean that they should have agency over us…
Whereas on the other hand, whatever OS I am running on my computer (Mac OSX for me, though I hear that some people on Lemmy prefer Arch btw:-D) very much should obey my commands. e.g. when I tell it to reboot or to shut down a misbehaving program, I want it to do it NOW (or at least… soon, even if it needs a few moments to wrap things up, that’s arguably far better b/c then it can do so safely). That, to me, seems to go beyond “might makes right”, b/c we literally put in love, care, attention, and design into making that OS. The gulf b/t human sentience vs. like a worm or even a bacteria is far lesser than the gulf b/t us vs. the programs that we write, in terms of autonomy. We own it b/c we MADE it. (I am ignoring future AIs where we set up the system but then it kinda makes itself - a fascinating thought that very likely could qualify for an exemption, so here I am just bypassing that line of thinking entirely)
Anyway, I love thinking such thoughts:-D. I have no idea if doing so offers practical benefits (I kinda do not care!:-P), but it very well might. e.g. just how much agency / oversight did Elon Musk offer to building his Tesla cars? With all the crashes & potentially actually fatal consequences, it seems that even he did not put in the effort to truly know what those cars are all about. Thus if some hacker were to do so, would they “take ownership”, and be able to bypass certain features & controls, in a manner that even Musk himself (& most of his engineers) has no idea exists - and in so doing, would they have that “right”, or is that just another example of “might makes right”, where they can & therefore they do? (which is a power that they could wield for good - e.g. go ahead and pay the subscription service, in order to help keep the company afloat, and yet still patch security vulnerabilities that the company itself never bothers to implement - so such a thought would not have to be solely due to piracy & stealing considerations)
According to such thinking then, if the Illuminati control the world, then can Anonymous help fix it, like Robin Hood? Except that Power Corrupts, and Absolutely Power… well the latter actually often turns around and converts to good, given enough time passing and the proclivities of the person, but even 99.99% Power corrupts nearly Absolutely, so it might end up being the other way around - perhaps they will merely join or subvert the Illuminati, or even become co-opted by them unknowingly? Trump presented himself as a style of “Robin Hood”-esque “savior” type, saying how he was going to “drain the swamp” and fix all the problems, but he did not work out so well. And while that attempt was blatantly obvious to anyone who has eyes, who is to say that the next attempt will be so readily detectable?
You do not need to apologize: Trump had a lot of us fooled, and I don’t think your underlying idea - motivated by compassion - is wrong at all. I happened to not be fooled, at least in that same sense, but only b/c of my background having been similarly fooled by earlier events (so without those, I easily could have been), and even now I agree that he did a lot of good: by exposing the vulnerabilities inherent in our system, he may have done a lot better than Hilary Clinton would have to cause them to be fixed? She would have papered over the whole situation - her whole message was just “the status quo is absolutely fine” - but it is FUCKING NOT FINE!!!?!!! So I understand why people voted against her, even if that meant voting for him. Even now, I think her particular brand of insensitivity to people’s needs is far more toxic & deadly than whatever Trump may have wrought for us - even if that leads to the death of America, it seems preferable to me to at least be honest about that death, rather than to keep claiming the “this is fine” meme (as in, “THIS IS FINE - OR ELSE!! Do not say that you are not fine, or you will be imprisoned!”). Unfortunately, Democrats seemed to have learned very little from the whole thing.:-(
Part of what I mean in that I am losing hope for democracy, is that I am wondering if I should be gaining hope in whatever may replace it? If this truly is a non-viable solution to begin with, then whatever we end up with later could potentially be better? Like, instead of a nation full of suicidal people who cannot afford housing and hate their jobs, what if we accepted that we are mere peasants and at least came to peaceful coexistence with that thought? I dunno, maybe I sound like a subversive there, but it is a thought that I cannot shake from my head. Is being a slave more “honest” than being a “free” employee, who nonetheless depends on their job for food/housing/medical care/existence? I guess you could say that I am questioning EVERYTHING - even just what our “freedom” may offer us? Unlike the earlier discussion points we mentioned, I despite these thoughts… but if they are coming at us regardless… then I at least want to struggle to open my eyes, regardless of whatever I might see:-(. In so doing, I am prepared to leave my religion, or double down harder on it, or shift it over to something else, or wherever the facts (as best as I can see them anyway) may take me. And that’s good imho - I feel proud about that aspect of myself:-).
If you see yourself in others, whom can you harm?
It is a common bumper sticker on vehicles that I saw a few years back, often alongside the words “Coexist”. The latter phrase is fantastic, but the phrase I mentioned really rubs me the wrong way. I believe it is Buddhist? Anyway, as you picked up on, my reaction was not how it was meant to be interpreted:-D - and I get that, and don’t even hold it against the statement itself, except… I still have my preferences about the whole affair, and I happen to hate it:-P, and I am okay with having that emotion about it. Life is a journey, not a destination, and all that.
I wanted to be sure that I conveyed that I feel like I cannot win when it becomes a “struggle” - even at best if one side or the other were to totally conquer the opponent, then I overall would lose.
Speaking of life being a journey, it seems to me that it was not meant for us to be comfortable 100% of the time, nor perhaps safe either. If we were hyper-diligent and did everything correctly, every time, would that be “good” - is that then our “goal”? Certainly the opposite cannot be true, b/c then we’d be dead, but is the goal then the opposite, or is that a fallacy of False Dilemma? Moreover, is there just one path through life, that a “perfect” person would have taken, let’s say if they were in my situation, or are there many ways, and our flaws are what make us beautiful, in part? This is one area where religion has helped inform my thinking: the word “perfection” should (perhaps) rather not mean “lacking any flaw” so much as “being complete, lacking nothing (major)”. Therefore I do not strive to eliminate my flaws as if this is some kind of war and my goal is to murderize my opponent, but rather I accept them, embrace them even, and thereby find my peace. And then I get up off my butt and do something about them, one at a time, and it never sticks, but still I keep moving forward - and you know what? That is enough for me. Perhaps Nirvana, for us, is not absence of pain - or in other words, even if it was, we are human beings and not meant to exist in such a state? Thus, I do not want Discipline to always win, nor Comfort to always win, but rather both, each as seems best in the current moment. Maybe that’s stupid of me, but it’s a thought.
Anyway, the context was that people love you, b/c you show care & attention to them - but I hope you also fail to do that sometimes as well too, so that you can take care of yourself as well? Yes, you read that correctly: I wish failure upon you (“muwha-ha, a pox upon thee!!”, ahem no wait, not like that!:-P), when/where/as appropriate, if that helps you to ultimately succeed. e.g. if you have a job interview the next morning, and you are fairly nervous about it, and then someone calls you at 2am needing something - perhaps they got drunk and wanted a ride home from 2 towns over or something - maybe don’t answer? Hopefully they’ll be fine, but you also need to be fine as well? The “right” thing to do in that moment may not always be to continue to give of yourself selflessly, if doing so would cost you a big job (which perhaps the drunk friend may not have even remembered, b/c of their drunkeness, but when sober they may have even agreed with the decision?). Anyway, you (Kendrick Lamar) already said it: “I choose me, I’m sorry” (hopefully not always as in “solely”, but at least sometimes it does need to be done!?).
Btw, good luck with your whole house situation - I am certain that cannot be trivially easy to handle:-).
(Mac OSX for me, though I hear that some people on Lemmy prefer Arch btw:-D)
Are you trying to tell me there are Linux users on Lemmy???
Anyway, I love thinking such thoughts:-D. I have no idea if doing so offers practical benefits
Well, they may and they may not! It all depends on if you sometimes share these thoughts or not. The time you spend thinking and the things you think about definitely has an impact on your future interactions. It does not if you never actually do anything with those thoughts. A person who spends all their time thinking has nothing but thoughts.
It’s funny, recently I was thinking about electric car jailbreaking. It’s something that I find very interesting as electric cars these days kinda remind me of the early iPhone days. There are definitely people working on such things as we speak which can be a scary thought as this could be used for evil as easily as it could be used for good.
According to such thinking then, if the Illuminati control the world, then can Anonymous help fix it, like Robin Hood?
Well, good and evil are human creations. Like we’ve talked about in our previous comments, one can not exist without the other. If there is an “illuminati” there is going to, at least eventually, be an equal opposing force. They will eventually mutually destroy each other, giving way to a new good and evil of our own creation. It is a never ending cycle. At least that is how I see it.
He (Trump) may have done a lot better than Hilary Clinton would have to cause them to be fixed? She would have papered over the whole situation - her whole message was just “the status quo is absolutely fine” - but it is FUCKING NOT FINE!!!?!!!
Agreed. There is always good to be found in any situation if you know where to look. We sometimes focus way too much on the bad things themselves to realize that they actually have a role to play in fostering good. Of course nobody wants to be stuck in a system where they’re unhappy but if we’re “happy” all the time we grow complacent. Sometimes we need a good slap in the face to wake up.
If this truly is a non-viable solution to begin with, then whatever we end up with later could potentially be better?
Absolutely. I don’t think that means we should be pushing for the death of democracy, but if that’s how you feel then by all means, do it. Your thoughts and feelings about the situation are valid, as are everybody elses. It just remains to see if there are enough people who feel the same way for them to have enough mass to actually move things. Whatever happens happens.
I still have my preferences about the whole affair (If you see yourself in others, whom can you harm?), and I happen to hate it:-P, and I am okay with having that emotion about it.
Bahah, absolutely valid. You’ve had experiences that have shaped the way you view things and you are not wrong to have those thoughts.
Perfection
Ahhhh perfection lol. That is a fun concept. We have a broken definition of perfection because we do not understand that there is nothing that is “without flaw”. “Flaws” are part of a perfect design. I consider myself a perfectionist which is why I never get anything done. How perfect is that? I find it laughable when people praise God, saying he makes no mistakes, but then go on and talk about things being abominations in the eyes of God. Like who the fuck do you think you are to say things like that? Again I’m not much of a “religion” person, but the older I get, the more I realize that life IS actually perfect and if there is actually a God it indeed makes no mistakes. It is mind-blowing to me the system of checks and balances that are built into life itself. Every error eventually corrects itself, which can spell catastrophe for us as a species but in the grand scheme of things it is absolutely beautiful.
Yes, you read that correctly: I wish failure upon you
Thank you, that is the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me 😭!!
For real though, I am choosing myself now. More than I ever have and it has had a positive impact on everyone around me so far. I’m still available to everyone when they really need me but I’m not scared to say no when it’s not that important and I need to do my own things. If there are still abusers in my midst they will soon make themselves visible but so far so good.
Btw, good luck with your whole house situation - I am certain that cannot be trivially easy to handle:-).
Thank you, it has been absolute hell so far but I have some really good friends helping me with the things I’m not so good at and things are moving. I already have people lined up to rent the upstairs and I’m able to rent to them cheaper than all the other places they had looked at so I’m really happy about that. They seem like really good people too so I’m excited to have them as neighbors.
Linux users: I too might be one at heart:-). Maybe? Though I do so love my Mac… it has such a pwetty candy shell - and it is even more POSIX compliant than Linux! :-P
Thoughts v. Actions: Our rights are steadily being taken away, though more often we simply given them away. I mentioned Mac vs. Linux so perhaps that is a good example: iOS is horrible, having everything locked down and not able to connect to your own device to do anything with it. Then again, Android is becoming increasingly like that as well, ever since Google got its hooks in. And yet, it is possible to administer your own device, even if it gets harder & harder over time. Mac OSX isn’t so bad, for a computer that you control, but iOS is, therefore that is where I draw the line.
For cars, what if like a police-person demanded access to your vehicle, and if their company override did not work, they could confiscate the car? Do you “own” your own vehicle? Worst of all, you have to pay the full price as if you did, so you do not even get the benefits of leasing - like if a hurricane destroyed it, who loses out - you or the company that leased it to you? (I don’t even know, does leasing work that way!?:-P) - and yet you depend on “leasing” the software, in perpetuity. So one day, if someone gets the bright idea that “going green” means not doing anything at all to actually work towards saving the planet, but instead everyone has to buy Musk-brand EVs (others have not been pre-approved so do not qualify), then at that point yeah I’d consider jailbreaking a car. Though the risk could be that you could lose the whole vehicle - Might may not Make Right, but it sure can be a powerful jackboot to come down upon your neck, if it so chooses. So like everything else, it would be a cost-benefit tradeoff.:-|
I don’t know if good & evil are human conventions - I mean obviously to some extent, definitely the part about what we “accept” is - but also, most people innately seem to feel certain things, so by virtue of being “natural”, are those things that are in-grained and inherent in us (and also other animals as well) the Truth, that we need to discover and obey b/c that is what will generate maximal Happiness for us?
To clarify, I am not “pushing” for the death of democracy. I am worried sick that it is coming, regardless of my wishes either way. I do not control the Maga-hat-Repubs, nor the corporate-stooge-Democrats either, and it looks like both sides are in agreement that e.g. the bottom HALF of all of Americans “should” only have 2% of the entire wealth of this country. I did not make that figure up btw… (article 1, from 5 years ago, and updated article 2). Why that is relevant is that no matter who wins the next election, the “American Dream” (white picket fence, ability to afford a child, 2.3 dogs or whatever) has already died, at least for the simple majority of citizenry.
Perfection & mistakes: setting aside a God or even a rung further down to a mere Creator, if we had a perfect “Father” or “President” or some such, or even “boss” at work, then would they not allow us to make our own mistakes, as part of thier being perfect? How else could we possibly learn? How else could we possibly be happy, if we were all robots will no free will, or more precisely not even the illusion of thus? On the other hand, sheeple gonna sheep, and that’s all there is to it: for many, what religion (or politics, or anything at all) “means” is that some book said it, hence it MUST be true - they don’t bother to figure it out, or even to search for proper interpretations. B/c they are stupid… and we have to come to terms with that - they just do not have capacity to evaluate such things, therefore they do not. Especially a parent/couple spending all of their time raising kids. I find that irl I have much more in common with people of all religions who are thinkers, than I do with people who may just so happen to believe similar word-sounds as myself, but who don’t have the faintest idea what those concepts even mean. Hehe, Jesus Himself agrees: “be ye either hot or cold, but for fucks sake, at least care about it one way or the other you f-ing plebes!?” (hehe, I may have modified that slightly:-D)
You are an awesome person and I love hearing how you think:-).
Yeah I might be one too. I really want to use Linux and I’ve tried it many times but I have had issues with it every single time. Now I only use Linux as a print server for my 3D printer, it’s amazing for that.
I loved iOS back in the day, IF it was jailbroken but after the iPhone 4 I switched to Android and never looked back. I currently despise my Android phone though. I hate what Samsung has done with their flavour of Android. It feels SO invasive. Currently looking at Pixel phones so I can use GrapheneOS.
For cars, what if like a police-person demanded access to your vehicle, and if their company override did not work, they could confiscate the car?
I wouldn’t be surprised if one day things devolved that far but being the ODD-type person I am, that would just make me want to jailbreak it even more.
To me, leasing the operating system that your car runs on basically means you don’t own your car and that is a major turn off. Automatic updates, having features one day and not having them the next, etc.
who loses out - you or the company that leased it to you? (I don’t even know, does leasing work that way!?:-P)
Bahah I really have no clue, I have never leased a car. Always bought used and I don’t see that changing anytime soon.
I don’t care about repercussions all that much, I’d rather deal with them if/when they come than stop myself from doing things just because I’m scared something may happen. Of course that depends on the situation but if we’re talking about modifying a device that you bought and paid for then I will do what I want, as long as I’m not endangering anyone. If I’m costing a multi-billion dollar corporation a couple dollars than that’s just something I’d be proud of.
I don’t know if good & evil are human conventions - I mean obviously to some extent, definitely the part about what we “accept” is
I mean, I don’t know either but yeah, I meant more like what we accept. I guess the way I see it is like, what if in the future, the only humans that are left to reproduce are the ones with psychopathic traits? They might have a whole other definition of what is good and what is bad/evil. I guess I don’t really know what goes on in the mind of a psychopath either so that hypothetical is probably not worth much hahah. Some animals do things that would seem absolutely evil to us, but would they think of it that way? I guess we don’t really know what they think about today or if they even think at all but whatever hahah.
are those things that are in-grained and inherent in us (and also other animals as well) the Truth, that we need to discover and obey b/c that is what will generate maximal Happiness for us?
It could very well be. We’ve evolved as a social species so it is in our best interest that everybody around us is happy and healthy. When things/people from outside our society threatens our health and happiness, we can commit great evils like it was nothing at all.
To clarify, I am not “pushing” for the death of democracy
Oh I wasn’t saying that you yourself actually were but more like, IF you were, I’d totally understand and respect it. Can’t blame anyone for being sick of this shit. You can’t get mad at a river for flowing where it does.
it looks like both sides are in agreement that e.g. the bottom HALF of all of Americans “should” only have 2% of the entire wealth of this country.
Yeah well that is a huge problem, but I doubt that most of the voters think that. That’s all the corruption. We don’t have a real choice anymore and it’s going to take a lot to change that. I’m all for eating the ultra-wealthy. People will eventually realize that they’re actually in an American Nightmare, wake up and demand their power back, at least I hope so. At that point, maybe the ruling class will loosen the leash a bit, or maybe they’ll kill us all or just leave the continent and let the vultures come pick at our dying carcasses, who knows.
then would they not allow us to make our own mistakes, as part of thier being perfect?
Well, maybe perfection includes accepting that mistakes are a part of getting to perfection. I guess it depends on how far we take “perfection” but if we were all born “perfect” for the world we are in, would we know how to deal with things that are unpredictable? Then again, absolute perfection could take away all the things that are unpredictable. I dunno, this whole line of thinking is breaking my brain at the moment hahah.
they don’t bother to figure it out, or even to search for proper interpretations. B/c they are stupid… and we have to come to terms with that - they just do not have capacity to evaluate such things, therefore they do not.
Well, some might not. Some were just indoctrinated so heavily from a young age that they can’t even conceive that their religion is not the Truth. I wouldn’t say they’re all stupid, but they certainly don’t waste time questioning these things like we do and I’m not sure that’s 100% a bad thing. For me it’s a bad thing because I enjoy thinking about these things and I do not want to blindly believe what a thousands of years old book is telling me about the nature of our existence. If I ended up at the same conclusion as my “Assigned Religion At Birth”, I wouldn’t be mad about wasting all that time thinking about it because that’s the game I decided to play and I didn’t want to just read the walkthrough.
Of course there’s always gonna be people who only have the capacity to repeat the things that were said to them. Those are the dangerous ones, the ones who are ripe for use and abuse. It is our responsibility to take care of them.
I find that irl I have much more in common with people of all religions who are thinkers, than I do with people who may just so happen to believe similar word-sounds as myself, but who don’t have the faintest idea what those concepts even mean.
Absolutely. I find I have much more in common with a religious thinker than I do with 99% of the people you’d find in Atheist communities even though you could easily think it’d be the opposite.
“be ye either hot or cold, but for fucks sake, at least care about it one way or the other you f-ing plebes!?”
100% my favorite passage!
You are an awesome person and I love hearing how you think:-).
Linux: I love the logic, the precision, the customizability… but I also like it when things werk, which it often has major issues with. Then again, I use Linux at my job on a daily basis, and even on my Unix Mac OSX I use things like the CLI and gVim, so I enjoy having that stability at home. Especially when I need to use a laptop - I need to be able to do things like connect to someone else’s wifi without having to install package dependencies first.
I bought an Apple phone once, expecting to eventually jailbreak it. But they took that capability away, so when it died I switched back to Android and will never even consider going back. Now, I too have a Samsung S22+ - and it is the only phone I have ever had that I outright despise. Tbf, I consider that my own fault for not selling my soul to them - yes it is on them for asking such, but I knew who they were, and decided to roll the dice on them anyway. I really miss the days when flagship killers existed, like the most famous one of all time OnePlus 7 (before the co-founder left the company when they announced their new direction to use the ColorOS used on all those cheap Huawei phones), and before that the Nexus line. I might try a Fairphone next, maybe? Or just a cheap dumbphone even - “smart” ones are more like “smartass” these days:-(. Pixels would be great - especially if you want to replace the OS - but I hardly use my camera as it is, and the specs otherwise are not great unless you spend much more, and there seems no longer to be a way to turn that around and get a “high-end phone with a cheap-ass camera”.
I thought - though I couldn’t readily point to any and I could be wrong - that studies have shown that children seem to have some kind of innate sense of “right vs. wrong”? Like if you walk up and take their candy away from them, they scream “hey, that’s not fair!”, like that would have a chance of working (and why wouldn’t it? but if the scene changed and these were gorillas instead of humans, then wouldn’t that have a possibility of getting yourself literally killed, for daring to challenge the larger apes, as an object lesson of power and “know your place”?). So, at least at the early stages, Might vs. Right may be in opposition to that kind of preschool/kindergarten level of morality? And then everything after that is modified by societal pressures - like spoiled children are “spoiled” by teaching them that their wants & needs matter more to their parents than the wants & needs of others. Like maybe they go out to eat and the kid of wealthy parents sees the servants jump at every whim of the master, and by implication the child as well - not understanding yet that they are being paid+tipped to do so - and internalize that sense of “I am a higher being than those sort are”.
So if morality changes in the future - as it 100% definitely will - it seems doubtful that the Nature side of it would be altered much, in a short period of time (in the evolutionary/geological timescale sense), and rather that the Nurture side would teach them differently. At which point I hope that they will be taught what works rather than what does not. In that sense, I like how the Bible - the collected wisdom of the ages - and basically every other revered tome like it from all religions across the globe acts to preserve what has been learned. e.g. adultery is bad (hurt feelings leading to all manner of problems), and unless under highly constrained circumstances, murder due to hot-headed feelings in the moment is bad, and stealing from someone is bad (it gets dicey when a rich fuck decides “this is mine now” - is it really stealing to simply take back what is yours? so having mentioned it, I will now promptly ignore it henceforth:-D), and so on. To the extent that these laws may capture something innate inside of us all, then it is good for us to have learned them. Perhaps in the future - or even now already - we can separate out the “religion” parts from what is truly good. As Jesus Himself offered: “be thou not dicks to one another, and instead be most excellent to one another, my dudes”.
And this is why I am turning more to religious thoughts lately, though it could be any alternative to politics - non- or not-for-profits, non-governmental organizations (NGOs), or extremely rarely even inside of those, like the Mr. Rogers character was a MOST EXCELLENT human being, both on- and off-camera (and too Gene Rodenberry, creator of Star Trek). Anyway the goal is: how can we help people, even when the major trend of that river of society is trying to bend away from that goal (taking away people’s livelihoods, making them work for literally DECADES to pay back student loans that are corruptly administered - i.e. a form of literal, actual, irl “slavery” if you will)? Occasionally I see a story that gives me hope (e.g. this one where he tries to fight against the trend), but they do seem to be coming much more rarely than in the past.:-| In any case, I need to create my own to attach meaning to in the more local sense of my own cares & wants & needs:-).
One problem with trying to define “perfection” is the age-old adage of what does the word “good” even mean? In the engineering sense, it means “good for something”, like a spoon is good for eating one type of, more liquidy, foodstuffs, whereas a knife is good for an entirely different and while not totally at least partially nonoverlapping set of foodstuffs, and then a knife is quite a bit different still from either (and as that movie Wall-E perfectly illustrates: sporks have their own whole thing going on!:-P). If you wanted to eat a soup, either a fork or a knife - or chopsticks, etc. - would not be “good”. And framed in that manner, we already immediately see that this is a whole non-starter, b/c paper > rock > scissors > …, which invalidates the logical chain of transitory thinking that if A leads to B and B leads to C, then surely A must lead to C as well, right? (nope! b/c otherwise, paper would beat scissors too) So the best we could ever hope for is to say that item A is good for some particular purpose, not good in any kind of objective, overall sense. At which point… how would “perfection” have a chance there of being tied to something in the objective world, if even “good” does not? Hence it remains subjective, unless we switch the meaning to some kind of objective standard - as in “lacking nothing” i.e. has all components of set X as defined by…
Humans, really all mammals, then have this whole wonderful thing where we are not perfect, and that adaptability to change is what has gotten us this far, even when dinosaurs and cockroaches and fishes and such - as measured by length of evolutionary time - were much more of a “success”. They were much more “attuned” to their specific circumstances, i.e. a highly defined set of parameters, whereas we are not, and therefore we are the only species that has even a ghost of a chance of possibly outlasting even our planet Earth instead (that we could create ourselves I mean - ofc whatever animals and such we took with us could go as well).
“Assigned Religion At Birth” -> I love that phrase, Imma have to steal it now!:-P I have already changed mine several times, and I absolutely see no reason to stick with things merely b/c they are old. Tbf, it does have some demonstrated value, but for those of us who can do better, we don’t need that - e.g. whenever we see the hypocrisy (e.g. priest “on the take”… or much worse), we can simply nope out and move on to greener pastures.
I would argue that sheeple - precisely like zombies - are not all that dangerous, at least individually, though en mass they constitute a real force to be reconed with. Even there, the necromancer behind them (if present) controlling that force is the REAL danger, b/c even if they lose every single one of those sheeple-tools, they can still come at you with new ones (money gives them power). George Romero’s Night of the Living Dead had several perfect examples, where like there were zero zombies present inside of a locked room, but then one of the living people died, and after that there was one zombie present. So it is not “the zombies” that were the chief danger, it was that space radiation or whatever in that case, that could continue to make more zombies. And in other genres like Resident Evil, the zombies were at the extreme low end of the spectrum of danger, which the company hid behind and continued to make MANY more, even more highly dangerous thingies and stuff and junk. And irl, Putin himself is no sheeple. Even if he were stripped of Fox News, and the entire nation of Russia, he still is iirc the literal top number 1 wealthiest person alive on the planet, plus his store of secrets that he could use to blackmail all the most powerful people, would make him (or whoever inherits all of that) quite a dangerous adversary indeed - entirely independent of unthinking Americans voting for conservative politicians. Especially if he also controls the liberal politicians too:-(.
I hope I am not straining your brain too awfully much - I trust you to say no though and slow down your responses, i.e. to take care of yourself first!
I need to be able to do things like connect to someone else’s wifi without having to install package dependencies first.
Yeah exactly, and it has happened to me way too many times where I install something, like system updates, only to reboot to find that my GUI doesn’t work anymore. I do not have time for this.
Now, I too have a Samsung S22+ - and it is the only phone I have ever had that I outright despise.
RIGHT?! That’s the same one I have. It’s the WORSE phone I’ve ever had the displeasure of owning. I bought it because I thought the camera would be the best out of what was available at the time but it is TERRIBLE. I miss my old Huawei P20 Pro. Say what you want about the CCP but that phone was BY FAR the best phone I’ve ever had. I still use it every day as a camera but it has no SIM anymore.
Fairphone is definitely interesting. Until there’s a whole new revolutionary mobile device that comes out, there’s really no reason to go for flagships anymore, they don’t offer anything new anymore, so why not go for something like the Fairphone. I feel like the Apple Vision Pro is the closest thing we’ve seen since the first iPhones. Of course it’s way too big and cumbersome for now but nothing else has given me that feeling in my gut since I first laid my hands on the iPhone.
Like if you walk up and take their candy away from them, they scream “hey, that’s not fair!”
Not saying you’re wrong at all here but, a lot of that could very well come from nurture and also you’re literally taking something away from them it could be more about personally losing something than it not being fair. Would they react the same way had they not yet been taught the concept of fairness and just seen someone take candy from another child?
So if morality changes in the future - as it 100% definitely will - it seems doubtful that the Nature side of it would be altered much, in a short period of time (in the evolutionary/geological timescale sense), and rather that the Nurture side would teach them differently.
Yeah probably not. Nobody likes to be hurt (Unless…) and that is not about to change.
As Jesus Himself offered: “be thou not dicks to one another, and instead be most excellent to one another, my dudes”.
🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏
And this is why I am turning more to religious thoughts lately
That is pretty much exactly why I am doing so as well. It just makes sense.
Anyway the goal is: how can we help people, even when the major trend of that river of society is trying to bend away from that goal
This has been my biggest revelation of my life. I can’t exactly explain it in words, but my answer to the question “How can we help people?” is to just help people. There’s always someone who needs help, no matter how big or small their problem might be. It feels to me like a lot of us have no sense of community anymore, at least outside of the internet. We need to rebuild this. Personally I’ve been doing it by changing the way I talk to people. I no longer just ask people “Hey how are you” as a meaningless greeting, I changed it to “How are you doing TODAY” to try and get a real answer out of them. Then if I can see an opening I will ask if there’s anything I can help them with. I also try to smile at everyone I lock eyes with, at least when my mental state is good enough for it. I really dislike looking people in the eyes in the first place so it takes a lot out of me.
I used to judge people based on the way they look a lot because you can kiiinda tell when someone is gonna be “conservative” or whatever, it’s a defense mechanism for me because I do not feel safe anywhere these days. However, by doing that, I’m doing exactly the same thing that people I’d call bigots would do. Judging someone on appearances. Sometimes I’m afraid that by doing so and letting my guard down, I might end up getting hurt. However, if I keep acting like random people are my enemy, I am perpetuating a cycle that must end.
Occasionally I see a story that gives me hope (e.g. this one where he tries to fight against the trend), but they do seem to be coming much more rarely than in the past.
I feel like that’s just because those stories don’t sell as well and/or they get immediately buried by ragebait.
I have to end this one here. I am so exhausted I can barely read, I keep catching myself re-reading the last sentence I just read hahah. I will be back.
I gave up on iOS entirely - I still love Mac OSX but I hate iOS, especially if I am constrained, b/c of work reasons, to still have to use a Google or Microsoft account. Apple just flat does not care what our needs are, out there irl, only what they want to provide. Now I am aware: if you sell your soul to them (by using exclusively their products), then they do take extremely good care of you. So long as you never even so much as dare to dream of venturing outside of their walled garden… you will be fine. But I just cannot live that way:-(. So I put up with the mess of Android, b/c it is still far better than the 1984-style “security” that iOS offers imho:-P.
Then again, I desperately do want a fairly stable daily driver, not an adventurous linux “experiment”:-D.
it could be more about personally losing something than it not being fair.
Oh yeah 100% agree there - all of humanity, and most especially children, use justification rather than purely logical reasoning.
my answer to the question “How can we help people?” is to just help people.
NO, I very much disagree, at least in my own sense. Then again, you did mention that it may not be phrased well, and your actual actions I 100% agree with so… there is that:-P. In general I think that such selfless act tend (even if not fully guaranteed) to be the better way, as in you help yourself and them at the same time - subject to your capacity ofc. A big issue there that I have agonized over in my mind is trans children. Since we know that younger humans use “justification” rather than pure “logic”, is it really helpful then to allow them access to surgeries that are not designed for that, not well-tested, and have an enormous failure rate (isn’t it like 50%?), where they can become crippled for life? Then again, I have no skin in that game really, and while I am mostly an ally in the sense that I think like “dare to be different” is a good thing, still I do wonder if those children are being taken advantage of by predatory doctors who are pushing expensive surgeries (like $100k USD a pop!), more than acting to help them be who they truly are. And some I believe truly are, but how do we know the difference b/t when it is helpful vs. harmful, and isn’t that related to age, or at least some measure of emotional maturity? I have read (on Reddit) in trans forums that even older trans people (who I trust more than myself to be cognizent of the issues involved?) are themselves against allowing literal children to go through that. To clarify, in case I am sounding “conservative” here myself (dErP), I am talking solely about children here, whatever that cutoff might be, like 15-18 or some such, and the goal is how to help them, not how to tell them what they can or cannot do (maybe the surgery could be allowed but not like federally approved for safety, or worse yet have some label attached to it, like those warnings on cigarettes? Anyway, I don’t mean to go deep into that issue per se, but rather to use it as an exemplar: “How can we help people?”, for me, requires some knowledge as to what, exactly, that is.
But ofc I am probably over-thinking it.:-D And yet even in doing so, I am offering my love to society in terms of trying to find that “correct” path. Not that I would tell much of anyone, so I don’t even know why really myself, except that it is in me to do so.
Anyway, when the answer seems more simple I just go for it - like I like to tip well, even putting in a dollar when I pick up food where no server is involved so it is not usual, and even if that could be 10-20% of the order cost. Those workers deserve their wages, and I need to be generous and that is one way to help support people who really are needing, wanting, and deserving of it!:-)
I feel like that’s just because those stories don’t sell as well and/or they get immediately buried by ragebait.
Sigh… yeah, everything seems to come back to money. There’s probably a morality/philosophy point in there somehow, like it tends to reflect what we value the most, as a society. Truth isn’t something we really care about, nor children, and for the most part we (the USA I mean) mostly care about healthcare when there are expensive drugs available for purchase, not so much at any other time.:-(
I applaud your efforts to remain open to experiences, possibilities, and loving one another - stay awesome gurl!:-D
I don’t have much time today but I have to touch on the trans children part of your post.
Sorry you’ve agonized over that, because it just doesn’t happen. Nobody wants children to have gender reassignment surgeries but that point has been used to attack transgender rights and healthcare over and over again and it’s not even a real thing. Nobody is actually getting them because it makes absolutely no sense to do it. You can’t do a surgeries like that on a body that is still growing, it will 100% turn out completely botched. The only surgery that could maybe make any sense on a minor may be the removal of breast tissue on transmasc people but that would only be required IF the child hasn’t been put on puberty blockers in time AND is experiencing major distress because of it. Everything else can wait. Hell, a large number of, if not most, trans people will never even get a single surgery. Hormone Replacement Therapy alone is very often enough and it is completely safe.
If it has happened, it was 100% done by a quack surgeon who needs to have their license removed. Literally nobody is going to argue against that except maybe for bad actors/astroturfers or perhaps actually insane people. Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see, please. You don’t even have to believe me but don’t go repeating that shit because it is extremely harmful.
It absolutely infuriates me because people keep repeating that as if it happens and it is being used to deny trans care to children, which is not surgeries but puberty blockers and hormone replacement therapy. Puberty blockers are used to delay puberty in case the patient is not certain about their gender identity and it is 100% reversible. What isn’t reversible is going through the “wrong puberty” and kids are now being forced to go through that in many states. Not only does going through the wrong puberty actually CREATES the need for more surgeries in the future, it is traumatic. Puberty is already really hard to go through once (Even worse if it’s the wrong one), imagine having to do it twice. I’ve done it, would not recommend if it can be avoided. Especially later in life when the mental anguish, mood swings and everything else that comes with going through puberty are really not “acceptable behaviours” anymore because then you’re an adult, you have way more responsibilities on your hands and by then people have forgotten exactly how crazy puberty was so they can’t even relate in any way. It is very alienating.
Also I don’t remember much of what I typed yesterday, I was basically half asleep but I should make it clear that what I meant by helping is only what I need to do and have been doing personally. It’s going to be different for everyone but for me the number one thing to do right now is to try and heal the divide between people on different spectrums and it is something that I actually have some kind of power over. I believe we really ought to stop wasting time and energy on things we have absolutely no power over as individuals and concentrate on getting people back together. Since I’m trans, well, I feel like it’s my responsibility now to forget about the divide and to be kind to everyone, even the ones who may not have kind thoughts about me so that we may have a chance to actually talk and find understanding. How are we supposed to tell people how things actually are for us if nobody even listens to us in the first place.
That’s from my point of view and something that only really applies to trans people as we have been thrust into this position we never wanted to be in, but I’m sure we all have something “simple” we can do to start taking baby steps towards regaining our power as people. To me, everything else is counterproductive and only serves to create more divide as we are completely unable to find common ground anywhere. How are we to make big societal and political changes without it getting bloody if we can’t agree on or even discuss the stupidest little things.
The saddest part is that in reality we all want the same thing but “They” have us fighting about manufactured issues and differences that don’t actually matter at all.
Thank you for helping put my mind at ease:-). Sadly, I think there are quack doctors, especially in the USA, but as you say the entire issue is so super-charged b/c on the other side you have things like those literally torture camps where they electroshock little children, often leading to their actual death. I think multiple of the latter have been created and directed over by someone who a decade or two later in life came out as gay themselves, and one or perhaps two even killed themselves - i.e. they hated themselves, b/c of their pseudo-religious bullshit treating Christianity not as “love one another” but rather as “do as I say” aka Might Equals Right and Conformity Is All. So then hurting the children sprung forth from their own mental illness, but in the process they created a panic among parents who wanted to “beat out the gay” from their children, who they ended up killing instead:-(.
The parallels between those stories and the anti-vax movement are profound: each relates to ignorance, and each results in a huge risk and often death to the most innocent among us:-(. And THAT is why I keep saying that I am losing hope for democracy: why should “citizens” have a say, in such INORDINANTLY COMPLEX matters, that require specialist knowledge, especially when there is (often Russian-derived, intentional) misinformation polluting the whole topic?! Except how else could be done - the State (e.g. China) decides, and everyone just has to follow its lead? Which brings us back to: the only solution forward would be to ensure that people receive a basic edumacashiun, so that we are better prepared to deal with such attacks on our system(s), even as we try to move forward into the future. But Christofascists on the one side, and corporate-backed liberals on the other, do seem a daunting pair of adversaries.
How are we supposed to tell people how things actually are for us if nobody even listens to us in the first place.
Amen, sistah! That is the really odd thing I find about most aspects of life - like “Evangelical” Christianity in particular, isn’t the goal there to “save” people, so then why go extremely out of your way to alienate them, via let’s say passing anti-abortion laws? All that on top of the fact that the Bible not only never says that Christians are meant to regulate non-Christians, but in fact it says the polar opposite of that! Christians are to judge “Christians” - e.g. when a priest diddles a child, THAT is something that should be judged! And also, Christians are specifically never ever to judge “non-Christians”, who have been granted freedom to live however they wish. The only grace I can manage to come up with for people who think like that - even though it included me for many of my early years - is that sheeple aren’t known for their ability to perform acts of higher thought. They are vulnerable. As are we all, just differently, is all.:-|
That said, there really is a line there, and that is when you step up to take away the rights of other people - properly warn them, yeah, maybe go so far as to require an extra consent form or some such, but when you actively prevent someone from doing as they please, that generates resentment. How the hell are people supposed to “evangelize” to someone who has just e.g. been tortured, perhaps to literal death? (successfully anyway) It makes them a hypocrite.
The saddest part is that in reality we all want the same thing but “They” have us fighting about manufactured issues and differences that don’t actually matter at all.
I agree so hard I can’t even throw in a nice phrase here about it, maybe I’ll just say “gulp”. Among well-meaning individuals, we can discuss ANYTHING at all, no matter how difficult, and if there’s something we don’t quite “get”, we can look it up. Maybe put our money where our mouths are and hire an expert to explain it to us. But we can get it done. However, among people who are not well-meaning, we can discuss NOTHING, b/c every single topic is merely being used as another avenue to preach their belief at someone, not merely virtue-signalling b/c they actually do mean it (sometimes), but still not all the way over to the other side in terms of being actually authentic. They must be quite lonely I imagine, and not comfortable in their own skin/heads, to need to resort to borrowing the actual thoughts of others rather than stare bravely at their own, following wherever they may lead. Take pity on them, but don’t let them be in charge!
It is not my place to tell you what to do, but I do hope that you get a chance to rest before replying to me - as much as I enjoy hearing from you, I want you to be happy even more:-).
YES - THIS IS IT!!! Like, whether we have free will or not, I do not know,(but as we mentioned, it doesn’t even matter b/c either way we need to act as if we do) but whether we SHOULD have free will is something that we could answer… if we knew for certain that there was an external entity. Star Trek is famous for exploring this. Like even if the actual Zeus did exist (they never met him iirc but Kirk did run into Apollo/Mercury at some point…), what “claim” would he have over humanity? Same with Arthur C. Clarke’s (2001 A Space Odyssey) saga: just b/c they gave us our start (into sentience, or even seeding DNA & thus life itself?) doesn’t necessarily mean that they should have agency over us…
Whereas on the other hand, whatever OS I am running on my computer (Mac OSX for me, though I hear that some people on Lemmy prefer Arch btw:-D) very much should obey my commands. e.g. when I tell it to reboot or to shut down a misbehaving program, I want it to do it NOW (or at least… soon, even if it needs a few moments to wrap things up, that’s arguably far better b/c then it can do so safely). That, to me, seems to go beyond “might makes right”, b/c we literally put in love, care, attention, and design into making that OS. The gulf b/t human sentience vs. like a worm or even a bacteria is far lesser than the gulf b/t us vs. the programs that we write, in terms of autonomy. We own it b/c we MADE it. (I am ignoring future AIs where we set up the system but then it kinda makes itself - a fascinating thought that very likely could qualify for an exemption, so here I am just bypassing that line of thinking entirely)
Anyway, I love thinking such thoughts:-D. I have no idea if doing so offers practical benefits (I kinda do not care!:-P), but it very well might. e.g. just how much agency / oversight did Elon Musk offer to building his Tesla cars? With all the crashes & potentially actually fatal consequences, it seems that even he did not put in the effort to truly know what those cars are all about. Thus if some hacker were to do so, would they “take ownership”, and be able to bypass certain features & controls, in a manner that even Musk himself (& most of his engineers) has no idea exists - and in so doing, would they have that “right”, or is that just another example of “might makes right”, where they can & therefore they do? (which is a power that they could wield for good - e.g. go ahead and pay the subscription service, in order to help keep the company afloat, and yet still patch security vulnerabilities that the company itself never bothers to implement - so such a thought would not have to be solely due to piracy & stealing considerations)
According to such thinking then, if the Illuminati control the world, then can Anonymous help fix it, like Robin Hood? Except that Power Corrupts, and Absolutely Power… well the latter actually often turns around and converts to good, given enough time passing and the proclivities of the person, but even 99.99% Power corrupts nearly Absolutely, so it might end up being the other way around - perhaps they will merely join or subvert the Illuminati, or even become co-opted by them unknowingly? Trump presented himself as a style of “Robin Hood”-esque “savior” type, saying how he was going to “drain the swamp” and fix all the problems, but he did not work out so well. And while that attempt was blatantly obvious to anyone who has eyes, who is to say that the next attempt will be so readily detectable?
You do not need to apologize: Trump had a lot of us fooled, and I don’t think your underlying idea - motivated by compassion - is wrong at all. I happened to not be fooled, at least in that same sense, but only b/c of my background having been similarly fooled by earlier events (so without those, I easily could have been), and even now I agree that he did a lot of good: by exposing the vulnerabilities inherent in our system, he may have done a lot better than Hilary Clinton would have to cause them to be fixed? She would have papered over the whole situation - her whole message was just “the status quo is absolutely fine” - but it is FUCKING NOT FINE!!!?!!! So I understand why people voted against her, even if that meant voting for him. Even now, I think her particular brand of insensitivity to people’s needs is far more toxic & deadly than whatever Trump may have wrought for us - even if that leads to the death of America, it seems preferable to me to at least be honest about that death, rather than to keep claiming the “this is fine” meme (as in, “THIS IS FINE - OR ELSE!! Do not say that you are not fine, or you will be imprisoned!”). Unfortunately, Democrats seemed to have learned very little from the whole thing.:-(
Part of what I mean in that I am losing hope for democracy, is that I am wondering if I should be gaining hope in whatever may replace it? If this truly is a non-viable solution to begin with, then whatever we end up with later could potentially be better? Like, instead of a nation full of suicidal people who cannot afford housing and hate their jobs, what if we accepted that we are mere peasants and at least came to peaceful coexistence with that thought? I dunno, maybe I sound like a subversive there, but it is a thought that I cannot shake from my head. Is being a slave more “honest” than being a “free” employee, who nonetheless depends on their job for food/housing/medical care/existence? I guess you could say that I am questioning EVERYTHING - even just what our “freedom” may offer us? Unlike the earlier discussion points we mentioned, I despite these thoughts… but if they are coming at us regardless… then I at least want to struggle to open my eyes, regardless of whatever I might see:-(. In so doing, I am prepared to leave my religion, or double down harder on it, or shift it over to something else, or wherever the facts (as best as I can see them anyway) may take me. And that’s good imho - I feel proud about that aspect of myself:-).
It is a common bumper sticker on vehicles that I saw a few years back, often alongside the words “Coexist”. The latter phrase is fantastic, but the phrase I mentioned really rubs me the wrong way. I believe it is Buddhist? Anyway, as you picked up on, my reaction was not how it was meant to be interpreted:-D - and I get that, and don’t even hold it against the statement itself, except… I still have my preferences about the whole affair, and I happen to hate it:-P, and I am okay with having that emotion about it. Life is a journey, not a destination, and all that.
Speaking of life being a journey, it seems to me that it was not meant for us to be comfortable 100% of the time, nor perhaps safe either. If we were hyper-diligent and did everything correctly, every time, would that be “good” - is that then our “goal”? Certainly the opposite cannot be true, b/c then we’d be dead, but is the goal then the opposite, or is that a fallacy of False Dilemma? Moreover, is there just one path through life, that a “perfect” person would have taken, let’s say if they were in my situation, or are there many ways, and our flaws are what make us beautiful, in part? This is one area where religion has helped inform my thinking: the word “perfection” should (perhaps) rather not mean “lacking any flaw” so much as “being complete, lacking nothing (major)”. Therefore I do not strive to eliminate my flaws as if this is some kind of war and my goal is to murderize my opponent, but rather I accept them, embrace them even, and thereby find my peace. And then I get up off my butt and do something about them, one at a time, and it never sticks, but still I keep moving forward - and you know what? That is enough for me. Perhaps Nirvana, for us, is not absence of pain - or in other words, even if it was, we are human beings and not meant to exist in such a state? Thus, I do not want Discipline to always win, nor Comfort to always win, but rather both, each as seems best in the current moment. Maybe that’s stupid of me, but it’s a thought.
Anyway, the context was that people love you, b/c you show care & attention to them - but I hope you also fail to do that sometimes as well too, so that you can take care of yourself as well? Yes, you read that correctly: I wish failure upon you (“muwha-ha, a pox upon thee!!”, ahem no wait, not like that!:-P), when/where/as appropriate, if that helps you to ultimately succeed. e.g. if you have a job interview the next morning, and you are fairly nervous about it, and then someone calls you at 2am needing something - perhaps they got drunk and wanted a ride home from 2 towns over or something - maybe don’t answer? Hopefully they’ll be fine, but you also need to be fine as well? The “right” thing to do in that moment may not always be to continue to give of yourself selflessly, if doing so would cost you a big job (which perhaps the drunk friend may not have even remembered, b/c of their drunkeness, but when sober they may have even agreed with the decision?). Anyway, you (Kendrick Lamar) already said it: “I choose me, I’m sorry” (hopefully not always as in “solely”, but at least sometimes it does need to be done!?).
Btw, good luck with your whole house situation - I am certain that cannot be trivially easy to handle:-).
Are you trying to tell me there are Linux users on Lemmy???
It’s funny, recently I was thinking about electric car jailbreaking. It’s something that I find very interesting as electric cars these days kinda remind me of the early iPhone days. There are definitely people working on such things as we speak which can be a scary thought as this could be used for evil as easily as it could be used for good.
Well, good and evil are human creations. Like we’ve talked about in our previous comments, one can not exist without the other. If there is an “illuminati” there is going to, at least eventually, be an equal opposing force. They will eventually mutually destroy each other, giving way to a new good and evil of our own creation. It is a never ending cycle. At least that is how I see it.
Agreed. There is always good to be found in any situation if you know where to look. We sometimes focus way too much on the bad things themselves to realize that they actually have a role to play in fostering good. Of course nobody wants to be stuck in a system where they’re unhappy but if we’re “happy” all the time we grow complacent. Sometimes we need a good slap in the face to wake up.
Absolutely. I don’t think that means we should be pushing for the death of democracy, but if that’s how you feel then by all means, do it. Your thoughts and feelings about the situation are valid, as are everybody elses. It just remains to see if there are enough people who feel the same way for them to have enough mass to actually move things. Whatever happens happens.
Bahah, absolutely valid. You’ve had experiences that have shaped the way you view things and you are not wrong to have those thoughts.
Ahhhh perfection lol. That is a fun concept. We have a broken definition of perfection because we do not understand that there is nothing that is “without flaw”. “Flaws” are part of a perfect design. I consider myself a perfectionist which is why I never get anything done. How perfect is that? I find it laughable when people praise God, saying he makes no mistakes, but then go on and talk about things being abominations in the eyes of God. Like who the fuck do you think you are to say things like that? Again I’m not much of a “religion” person, but the older I get, the more I realize that life IS actually perfect and if there is actually a God it indeed makes no mistakes. It is mind-blowing to me the system of checks and balances that are built into life itself. Every error eventually corrects itself, which can spell catastrophe for us as a species but in the grand scheme of things it is absolutely beautiful.
Thank you, that is the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me 😭!!
For real though, I am choosing myself now. More than I ever have and it has had a positive impact on everyone around me so far. I’m still available to everyone when they really need me but I’m not scared to say no when it’s not that important and I need to do my own things. If there are still abusers in my midst they will soon make themselves visible but so far so good.
Thank you, it has been absolute hell so far but I have some really good friends helping me with the things I’m not so good at and things are moving. I already have people lined up to rent the upstairs and I’m able to rent to them cheaper than all the other places they had looked at so I’m really happy about that. They seem like really good people too so I’m excited to have them as neighbors.
Linux users: I too might be one at heart:-). Maybe? Though I do so love my Mac… it has such a pwetty candy shell - and it is even more POSIX compliant than Linux! :-P
Thoughts v. Actions: Our rights are steadily being taken away, though more often we simply given them away. I mentioned Mac vs. Linux so perhaps that is a good example: iOS is horrible, having everything locked down and not able to connect to your own device to do anything with it. Then again, Android is becoming increasingly like that as well, ever since Google got its hooks in. And yet, it is possible to administer your own device, even if it gets harder & harder over time. Mac OSX isn’t so bad, for a computer that you control, but iOS is, therefore that is where I draw the line.
For cars, what if like a police-person demanded access to your vehicle, and if their company override did not work, they could confiscate the car? Do you “own” your own vehicle? Worst of all, you have to pay the full price as if you did, so you do not even get the benefits of leasing - like if a hurricane destroyed it, who loses out - you or the company that leased it to you? (I don’t even know, does leasing work that way!?:-P) - and yet you depend on “leasing” the software, in perpetuity. So one day, if someone gets the bright idea that “going green” means not doing anything at all to actually work towards saving the planet, but instead everyone has to buy Musk-brand EVs (others have not been pre-approved so do not qualify), then at that point yeah I’d consider jailbreaking a car. Though the risk could be that you could lose the whole vehicle - Might may not Make Right, but it sure can be a powerful jackboot to come down upon your neck, if it so chooses. So like everything else, it would be a cost-benefit tradeoff.:-|
I don’t know if good & evil are human conventions - I mean obviously to some extent, definitely the part about what we “accept” is - but also, most people innately seem to feel certain things, so by virtue of being “natural”, are those things that are in-grained and inherent in us (and also other animals as well) the Truth, that we need to discover and obey b/c that is what will generate maximal Happiness for us?
To clarify, I am not “pushing” for the death of democracy. I am worried sick that it is coming, regardless of my wishes either way. I do not control the Maga-hat-Repubs, nor the corporate-stooge-Democrats either, and it looks like both sides are in agreement that e.g. the bottom HALF of all of Americans “should” only have 2% of the entire wealth of this country. I did not make that figure up btw… (article 1, from 5 years ago, and updated article 2). Why that is relevant is that no matter who wins the next election, the “American Dream” (white picket fence, ability to afford a child, 2.3 dogs or whatever) has already died, at least for the simple majority of citizenry.
Perfection & mistakes: setting aside a God or even a rung further down to a mere Creator, if we had a perfect “Father” or “President” or some such, or even “boss” at work, then would they not allow us to make our own mistakes, as part of thier being perfect? How else could we possibly learn? How else could we possibly be happy, if we were all robots will no free will, or more precisely not even the illusion of thus? On the other hand, sheeple gonna sheep, and that’s all there is to it: for many, what religion (or politics, or anything at all) “means” is that some book said it, hence it MUST be true - they don’t bother to figure it out, or even to search for proper interpretations. B/c they are stupid… and we have to come to terms with that - they just do not have capacity to evaluate such things, therefore they do not. Especially a parent/couple spending all of their time raising kids. I find that irl I have much more in common with people of all religions who are thinkers, than I do with people who may just so happen to believe similar word-sounds as myself, but who don’t have the faintest idea what those concepts even mean. Hehe, Jesus Himself agrees: “be ye either hot or cold, but for fucks sake, at least care about it one way or the other you f-ing plebes!?” (hehe, I may have modified that slightly:-D)
You are an awesome person and I love hearing how you think:-).
Yeah I might be one too. I really want to use Linux and I’ve tried it many times but I have had issues with it every single time. Now I only use Linux as a print server for my 3D printer, it’s amazing for that.
I loved iOS back in the day, IF it was jailbroken but after the iPhone 4 I switched to Android and never looked back. I currently despise my Android phone though. I hate what Samsung has done with their flavour of Android. It feels SO invasive. Currently looking at Pixel phones so I can use GrapheneOS.
I wouldn’t be surprised if one day things devolved that far but being the ODD-type person I am, that would just make me want to jailbreak it even more.
To me, leasing the operating system that your car runs on basically means you don’t own your car and that is a major turn off. Automatic updates, having features one day and not having them the next, etc.
Bahah I really have no clue, I have never leased a car. Always bought used and I don’t see that changing anytime soon.
I don’t care about repercussions all that much, I’d rather deal with them if/when they come than stop myself from doing things just because I’m scared something may happen. Of course that depends on the situation but if we’re talking about modifying a device that you bought and paid for then I will do what I want, as long as I’m not endangering anyone. If I’m costing a multi-billion dollar corporation a couple dollars than that’s just something I’d be proud of.
I mean, I don’t know either but yeah, I meant more like what we accept. I guess the way I see it is like, what if in the future, the only humans that are left to reproduce are the ones with psychopathic traits? They might have a whole other definition of what is good and what is bad/evil. I guess I don’t really know what goes on in the mind of a psychopath either so that hypothetical is probably not worth much hahah. Some animals do things that would seem absolutely evil to us, but would they think of it that way? I guess we don’t really know what they think about today or if they even think at all but whatever hahah.
It could very well be. We’ve evolved as a social species so it is in our best interest that everybody around us is happy and healthy. When things/people from outside our society threatens our health and happiness, we can commit great evils like it was nothing at all.
Oh I wasn’t saying that you yourself actually were but more like, IF you were, I’d totally understand and respect it. Can’t blame anyone for being sick of this shit. You can’t get mad at a river for flowing where it does.
Yeah well that is a huge problem, but I doubt that most of the voters think that. That’s all the corruption. We don’t have a real choice anymore and it’s going to take a lot to change that. I’m all for eating the ultra-wealthy. People will eventually realize that they’re actually in an American Nightmare, wake up and demand their power back, at least I hope so. At that point, maybe the ruling class will loosen the leash a bit, or maybe they’ll kill us all or just leave the continent and let the vultures come pick at our dying carcasses, who knows.
Well, maybe perfection includes accepting that mistakes are a part of getting to perfection. I guess it depends on how far we take “perfection” but if we were all born “perfect” for the world we are in, would we know how to deal with things that are unpredictable? Then again, absolute perfection could take away all the things that are unpredictable. I dunno, this whole line of thinking is breaking my brain at the moment hahah.
Well, some might not. Some were just indoctrinated so heavily from a young age that they can’t even conceive that their religion is not the Truth. I wouldn’t say they’re all stupid, but they certainly don’t waste time questioning these things like we do and I’m not sure that’s 100% a bad thing. For me it’s a bad thing because I enjoy thinking about these things and I do not want to blindly believe what a thousands of years old book is telling me about the nature of our existence. If I ended up at the same conclusion as my “Assigned Religion At Birth”, I wouldn’t be mad about wasting all that time thinking about it because that’s the game I decided to play and I didn’t want to just read the walkthrough.
Of course there’s always gonna be people who only have the capacity to repeat the things that were said to them. Those are the dangerous ones, the ones who are ripe for use and abuse. It is our responsibility to take care of them.
Absolutely. I find I have much more in common with a religious thinker than I do with 99% of the people you’d find in Atheist communities even though you could easily think it’d be the opposite.
100% my favorite passage!
It is reciprocal.
Linux: I love the logic, the precision, the customizability… but I also like it when things werk, which it often has major issues with. Then again, I use Linux at my job on a daily basis, and even on my Unix Mac OSX I use things like the CLI and gVim, so I enjoy having that stability at home. Especially when I need to use a laptop - I need to be able to do things like connect to someone else’s wifi without having to install package dependencies first.
I bought an Apple phone once, expecting to eventually jailbreak it. But they took that capability away, so when it died I switched back to Android and will never even consider going back. Now, I too have a Samsung S22+ - and it is the only phone I have ever had that I outright despise. Tbf, I consider that my own fault for not selling my soul to them - yes it is on them for asking such, but I knew who they were, and decided to roll the dice on them anyway. I really miss the days when flagship killers existed, like the most famous one of all time OnePlus 7 (before the co-founder left the company when they announced their new direction to use the ColorOS used on all those cheap Huawei phones), and before that the Nexus line. I might try a Fairphone next, maybe? Or just a cheap dumbphone even - “smart” ones are more like “smartass” these days:-(. Pixels would be great - especially if you want to replace the OS - but I hardly use my camera as it is, and the specs otherwise are not great unless you spend much more, and there seems no longer to be a way to turn that around and get a “high-end phone with a cheap-ass camera”.
I thought - though I couldn’t readily point to any and I could be wrong - that studies have shown that children seem to have some kind of innate sense of “right vs. wrong”? Like if you walk up and take their candy away from them, they scream “hey, that’s not fair!”, like that would have a chance of working (and why wouldn’t it? but if the scene changed and these were gorillas instead of humans, then wouldn’t that have a possibility of getting yourself literally killed, for daring to challenge the larger apes, as an object lesson of power and “know your place”?). So, at least at the early stages, Might vs. Right may be in opposition to that kind of preschool/kindergarten level of morality? And then everything after that is modified by societal pressures - like spoiled children are “spoiled” by teaching them that their wants & needs matter more to their parents than the wants & needs of others. Like maybe they go out to eat and the kid of wealthy parents sees the servants jump at every whim of the master, and by implication the child as well - not understanding yet that they are being paid+tipped to do so - and internalize that sense of “I am a higher being than those sort are”.
So if morality changes in the future - as it 100% definitely will - it seems doubtful that the Nature side of it would be altered much, in a short period of time (in the evolutionary/geological timescale sense), and rather that the Nurture side would teach them differently. At which point I hope that they will be taught what works rather than what does not. In that sense, I like how the Bible - the collected wisdom of the ages - and basically every other revered tome like it from all religions across the globe acts to preserve what has been learned. e.g. adultery is bad (hurt feelings leading to all manner of problems), and unless under highly constrained circumstances, murder due to hot-headed feelings in the moment is bad, and stealing from someone is bad (it gets dicey when a rich fuck decides “this is mine now” - is it really stealing to simply take back what is yours? so having mentioned it, I will now promptly ignore it henceforth:-D), and so on. To the extent that these laws may capture something innate inside of us all, then it is good for us to have learned them. Perhaps in the future - or even now already - we can separate out the “religion” parts from what is truly good. As Jesus Himself offered: “be thou not dicks to one another, and instead be most excellent to one another, my dudes”.
And this is why I am turning more to religious thoughts lately, though it could be any alternative to politics - non- or not-for-profits, non-governmental organizations (NGOs), or extremely rarely even inside of those, like the Mr. Rogers character was a MOST EXCELLENT human being, both on- and off-camera (and too Gene Rodenberry, creator of Star Trek). Anyway the goal is: how can we help people, even when the major trend of that river of society is trying to bend away from that goal (taking away people’s livelihoods, making them work for literally DECADES to pay back student loans that are corruptly administered - i.e. a form of literal, actual, irl “slavery” if you will)? Occasionally I see a story that gives me hope (e.g. this one where he tries to fight against the trend), but they do seem to be coming much more rarely than in the past.:-| In any case, I need to create my own to attach meaning to in the more local sense of my own cares & wants & needs:-).
One problem with trying to define “perfection” is the age-old adage of what does the word “good” even mean? In the engineering sense, it means “good for something”, like a spoon is good for eating one type of, more liquidy, foodstuffs, whereas a knife is good for an entirely different and while not totally at least partially nonoverlapping set of foodstuffs, and then a knife is quite a bit different still from either (and as that movie Wall-E perfectly illustrates: sporks have their own whole thing going on!:-P). If you wanted to eat a soup, either a fork or a knife - or chopsticks, etc. - would not be “good”. And framed in that manner, we already immediately see that this is a whole non-starter, b/c paper > rock > scissors > …, which invalidates the logical chain of transitory thinking that if A leads to B and B leads to C, then surely A must lead to C as well, right? (nope! b/c otherwise, paper would beat scissors too) So the best we could ever hope for is to say that item A is good for some particular purpose, not good in any kind of objective, overall sense. At which point… how would “perfection” have a chance there of being tied to something in the objective world, if even “good” does not? Hence it remains subjective, unless we switch the meaning to some kind of objective standard - as in “lacking nothing” i.e. has all components of set X as defined by…
Humans, really all mammals, then have this whole wonderful thing where we are not perfect, and that adaptability to change is what has gotten us this far, even when dinosaurs and cockroaches and fishes and such - as measured by length of evolutionary time - were much more of a “success”. They were much more “attuned” to their specific circumstances, i.e. a highly defined set of parameters, whereas we are not, and therefore we are the only species that has even a ghost of a chance of possibly outlasting even our planet Earth instead (that we could create ourselves I mean - ofc whatever animals and such we took with us could go as well).
“Assigned Religion At Birth” -> I love that phrase, Imma have to steal it now!:-P I have already changed mine several times, and I absolutely see no reason to stick with things merely b/c they are old. Tbf, it does have some demonstrated value, but for those of us who can do better, we don’t need that - e.g. whenever we see the hypocrisy (e.g. priest “on the take”… or much worse), we can simply nope out and move on to greener pastures.
I would argue that sheeple - precisely like zombies - are not all that dangerous, at least individually, though en mass they constitute a real force to be reconed with. Even there, the necromancer behind them (if present) controlling that force is the REAL danger, b/c even if they lose every single one of those sheeple-tools, they can still come at you with new ones (money gives them power). George Romero’s Night of the Living Dead had several perfect examples, where like there were zero zombies present inside of a locked room, but then one of the living people died, and after that there was one zombie present. So it is not “the zombies” that were the chief danger, it was that space radiation or whatever in that case, that could continue to make more zombies. And in other genres like Resident Evil, the zombies were at the extreme low end of the spectrum of danger, which the company hid behind and continued to make MANY more, even more highly dangerous thingies and stuff and junk. And irl, Putin himself is no sheeple. Even if he were stripped of Fox News, and the entire nation of Russia, he still is iirc the literal top number 1 wealthiest person alive on the planet, plus his store of secrets that he could use to blackmail all the most powerful people, would make him (or whoever inherits all of that) quite a dangerous adversary indeed - entirely independent of unthinking Americans voting for conservative politicians. Especially if he also controls the liberal politicians too:-(.
I hope I am not straining your brain too awfully much - I trust you to say no though and slow down your responses, i.e. to take care of yourself first!
Yeah exactly, and it has happened to me way too many times where I install something, like system updates, only to reboot to find that my GUI doesn’t work anymore. I do not have time for this.
RIGHT?! That’s the same one I have. It’s the WORSE phone I’ve ever had the displeasure of owning. I bought it because I thought the camera would be the best out of what was available at the time but it is TERRIBLE. I miss my old Huawei P20 Pro. Say what you want about the CCP but that phone was BY FAR the best phone I’ve ever had. I still use it every day as a camera but it has no SIM anymore.
Fairphone is definitely interesting. Until there’s a whole new revolutionary mobile device that comes out, there’s really no reason to go for flagships anymore, they don’t offer anything new anymore, so why not go for something like the Fairphone. I feel like the Apple Vision Pro is the closest thing we’ve seen since the first iPhones. Of course it’s way too big and cumbersome for now but nothing else has given me that feeling in my gut since I first laid my hands on the iPhone.
Not saying you’re wrong at all here but, a lot of that could very well come from nurture and also you’re literally taking something away from them it could be more about personally losing something than it not being fair. Would they react the same way had they not yet been taught the concept of fairness and just seen someone take candy from another child?
Yeah probably not. Nobody likes to be hurt (Unless…) and that is not about to change.
🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏
That is pretty much exactly why I am doing so as well. It just makes sense.
This has been my biggest revelation of my life. I can’t exactly explain it in words, but my answer to the question “How can we help people?” is to just help people. There’s always someone who needs help, no matter how big or small their problem might be. It feels to me like a lot of us have no sense of community anymore, at least outside of the internet. We need to rebuild this. Personally I’ve been doing it by changing the way I talk to people. I no longer just ask people “Hey how are you” as a meaningless greeting, I changed it to “How are you doing TODAY” to try and get a real answer out of them. Then if I can see an opening I will ask if there’s anything I can help them with. I also try to smile at everyone I lock eyes with, at least when my mental state is good enough for it. I really dislike looking people in the eyes in the first place so it takes a lot out of me.
I used to judge people based on the way they look a lot because you can kiiinda tell when someone is gonna be “conservative” or whatever, it’s a defense mechanism for me because I do not feel safe anywhere these days. However, by doing that, I’m doing exactly the same thing that people I’d call bigots would do. Judging someone on appearances. Sometimes I’m afraid that by doing so and letting my guard down, I might end up getting hurt. However, if I keep acting like random people are my enemy, I am perpetuating a cycle that must end.
I feel like that’s just because those stories don’t sell as well and/or they get immediately buried by ragebait.
I have to end this one here. I am so exhausted I can barely read, I keep catching myself re-reading the last sentence I just read hahah. I will be back.
I gave up on iOS entirely - I still love Mac OSX but I hate iOS, especially if I am constrained, b/c of work reasons, to still have to use a Google or Microsoft account. Apple just flat does not care what our needs are, out there irl, only what they want to provide. Now I am aware: if you sell your soul to them (by using exclusively their products), then they do take extremely good care of you. So long as you never even so much as dare to dream of venturing outside of their walled garden… you will be fine. But I just cannot live that way:-(. So I put up with the mess of Android, b/c it is still far better than the 1984-style “security” that iOS offers imho:-P.
Then again, I desperately do want a fairly stable daily driver, not an adventurous linux “experiment”:-D.
Oh yeah 100% agree there - all of humanity, and most especially children, use justification rather than purely logical reasoning.
NO, I very much disagree, at least in my own sense. Then again, you did mention that it may not be phrased well, and your actual actions I 100% agree with so… there is that:-P. In general I think that such selfless act tend (even if not fully guaranteed) to be the better way, as in you help yourself and them at the same time - subject to your capacity ofc. A big issue there that I have agonized over in my mind is trans children. Since we know that younger humans use “justification” rather than pure “logic”, is it really helpful then to allow them access to surgeries that are not designed for that, not well-tested, and have an enormous failure rate (isn’t it like 50%?), where they can become crippled for life? Then again, I have no skin in that game really, and while I am mostly an ally in the sense that I think like “dare to be different” is a good thing, still I do wonder if those children are being taken advantage of by predatory doctors who are pushing expensive surgeries (like $100k USD a pop!), more than acting to help them be who they truly are. And some I believe truly are, but how do we know the difference b/t when it is helpful vs. harmful, and isn’t that related to age, or at least some measure of emotional maturity? I have read (on Reddit) in trans forums that even older trans people (who I trust more than myself to be cognizent of the issues involved?) are themselves against allowing literal children to go through that. To clarify, in case I am sounding “conservative” here myself (dErP), I am talking solely about children here, whatever that cutoff might be, like 15-18 or some such, and the goal is how to help them, not how to tell them what they can or cannot do (maybe the surgery could be allowed but not like federally approved for safety, or worse yet have some label attached to it, like those warnings on cigarettes? Anyway, I don’t mean to go deep into that issue per se, but rather to use it as an exemplar: “How can we help people?”, for me, requires some knowledge as to what, exactly, that is.
But ofc I am probably over-thinking it.:-D And yet even in doing so, I am offering my love to society in terms of trying to find that “correct” path. Not that I would tell much of anyone, so I don’t even know why really myself, except that it is in me to do so.
Anyway, when the answer seems more simple I just go for it - like I like to tip well, even putting in a dollar when I pick up food where no server is involved so it is not usual, and even if that could be 10-20% of the order cost. Those workers deserve their wages, and I need to be generous and that is one way to help support people who really are needing, wanting, and deserving of it!:-)
Sigh… yeah, everything seems to come back to money. There’s probably a morality/philosophy point in there somehow, like it tends to reflect what we value the most, as a society. Truth isn’t something we really care about, nor children, and for the most part we (the USA I mean) mostly care about healthcare when there are expensive drugs available for purchase, not so much at any other time.:-(
I applaud your efforts to remain open to experiences, possibilities, and loving one another - stay awesome gurl!:-D
I don’t have much time today but I have to touch on the trans children part of your post.
Sorry you’ve agonized over that, because it just doesn’t happen. Nobody wants children to have gender reassignment surgeries but that point has been used to attack transgender rights and healthcare over and over again and it’s not even a real thing. Nobody is actually getting them because it makes absolutely no sense to do it. You can’t do a surgeries like that on a body that is still growing, it will 100% turn out completely botched. The only surgery that could maybe make any sense on a minor may be the removal of breast tissue on transmasc people but that would only be required IF the child hasn’t been put on puberty blockers in time AND is experiencing major distress because of it. Everything else can wait. Hell, a large number of, if not most, trans people will never even get a single surgery. Hormone Replacement Therapy alone is very often enough and it is completely safe.
If it has happened, it was 100% done by a quack surgeon who needs to have their license removed. Literally nobody is going to argue against that except maybe for bad actors/astroturfers or perhaps actually insane people. Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see, please. You don’t even have to believe me but don’t go repeating that shit because it is extremely harmful.
It absolutely infuriates me because people keep repeating that as if it happens and it is being used to deny trans care to children, which is not surgeries but puberty blockers and hormone replacement therapy. Puberty blockers are used to delay puberty in case the patient is not certain about their gender identity and it is 100% reversible. What isn’t reversible is going through the “wrong puberty” and kids are now being forced to go through that in many states. Not only does going through the wrong puberty actually CREATES the need for more surgeries in the future, it is traumatic. Puberty is already really hard to go through once (Even worse if it’s the wrong one), imagine having to do it twice. I’ve done it, would not recommend if it can be avoided. Especially later in life when the mental anguish, mood swings and everything else that comes with going through puberty are really not “acceptable behaviours” anymore because then you’re an adult, you have way more responsibilities on your hands and by then people have forgotten exactly how crazy puberty was so they can’t even relate in any way. It is very alienating.
Also I don’t remember much of what I typed yesterday, I was basically half asleep but I should make it clear that what I meant by helping is only what I need to do and have been doing personally. It’s going to be different for everyone but for me the number one thing to do right now is to try and heal the divide between people on different spectrums and it is something that I actually have some kind of power over. I believe we really ought to stop wasting time and energy on things we have absolutely no power over as individuals and concentrate on getting people back together. Since I’m trans, well, I feel like it’s my responsibility now to forget about the divide and to be kind to everyone, even the ones who may not have kind thoughts about me so that we may have a chance to actually talk and find understanding. How are we supposed to tell people how things actually are for us if nobody even listens to us in the first place.
That’s from my point of view and something that only really applies to trans people as we have been thrust into this position we never wanted to be in, but I’m sure we all have something “simple” we can do to start taking baby steps towards regaining our power as people. To me, everything else is counterproductive and only serves to create more divide as we are completely unable to find common ground anywhere. How are we to make big societal and political changes without it getting bloody if we can’t agree on or even discuss the stupidest little things.
The saddest part is that in reality we all want the same thing but “They” have us fighting about manufactured issues and differences that don’t actually matter at all.
Thank you for helping put my mind at ease:-). Sadly, I think there are quack doctors, especially in the USA, but as you say the entire issue is so super-charged b/c on the other side you have things like those literally torture camps where they electroshock little children, often leading to their actual death. I think multiple of the latter have been created and directed over by someone who a decade or two later in life came out as gay themselves, and one or perhaps two even killed themselves - i.e. they hated themselves, b/c of their pseudo-religious bullshit treating Christianity not as “love one another” but rather as “do as I say” aka Might Equals Right and Conformity Is All. So then hurting the children sprung forth from their own mental illness, but in the process they created a panic among parents who wanted to “beat out the gay” from their children, who they ended up killing instead:-(.
The parallels between those stories and the anti-vax movement are profound: each relates to ignorance, and each results in a huge risk and often death to the most innocent among us:-(. And THAT is why I keep saying that I am losing hope for democracy: why should “citizens” have a say, in such INORDINANTLY COMPLEX matters, that require specialist knowledge, especially when there is (often Russian-derived, intentional) misinformation polluting the whole topic?! Except how else could be done - the State (e.g. China) decides, and everyone just has to follow its lead? Which brings us back to: the only solution forward would be to ensure that people receive a basic edumacashiun, so that we are better prepared to deal with such attacks on our system(s), even as we try to move forward into the future. But Christofascists on the one side, and corporate-backed liberals on the other, do seem a daunting pair of adversaries.
Amen, sistah! That is the really odd thing I find about most aspects of life - like “Evangelical” Christianity in particular, isn’t the goal there to “save” people, so then why go extremely out of your way to alienate them, via let’s say passing anti-abortion laws? All that on top of the fact that the Bible not only never says that Christians are meant to regulate non-Christians, but in fact it says the polar opposite of that! Christians are to judge “Christians” - e.g. when a priest diddles a child, THAT is something that should be judged! And also, Christians are specifically never ever to judge “non-Christians”, who have been granted freedom to live however they wish. The only grace I can manage to come up with for people who think like that - even though it included me for many of my early years - is that sheeple aren’t known for their ability to perform acts of higher thought. They are vulnerable. As are we all, just differently, is all.:-|
That said, there really is a line there, and that is when you step up to take away the rights of other people - properly warn them, yeah, maybe go so far as to require an extra consent form or some such, but when you actively prevent someone from doing as they please, that generates resentment. How the hell are people supposed to “evangelize” to someone who has just e.g. been tortured, perhaps to literal death? (successfully anyway) It makes them a hypocrite.
I agree so hard I can’t even throw in a nice phrase here about it, maybe I’ll just say “gulp”. Among well-meaning individuals, we can discuss ANYTHING at all, no matter how difficult, and if there’s something we don’t quite “get”, we can look it up. Maybe put our money where our mouths are and hire an expert to explain it to us. But we can get it done. However, among people who are not well-meaning, we can discuss NOTHING, b/c every single topic is merely being used as another avenue to preach their belief at someone, not merely virtue-signalling b/c they actually do mean it (sometimes), but still not all the way over to the other side in terms of being actually authentic. They must be quite lonely I imagine, and not comfortable in their own skin/heads, to need to resort to borrowing the actual thoughts of others rather than stare bravely at their own, following wherever they may lead. Take pity on them, but don’t let them be in charge!
It is not my place to tell you what to do, but I do hope that you get a chance to rest before replying to me - as much as I enjoy hearing from you, I want you to be happy even more:-).