I suspect if the cracking code was constructed such that it had more weight on trying combinations of common words then this would be much easier to crack
I would naively think that as well - you would expand your alphabet of “symbols” to include both single letters and numbers and punctuation but also common words as well. It is still a lot of combinations to have to try though, even if less than each letter by itself.
Example of what My passwords are like : %*7EfOLkN@6AP28!8Dl#
or potentially if allowed : W@c2wYnN9J3xGcyc47#ZkHJvt&Hm%q&Ad0b&Xwz#jnl4Th%6UBexD16a$YBFc@svnVrCBxXP0EpwLp6%Gk*Lom%@Qq#DjY1zsf0CzIrHHqPc8gt4edDVsg!omj*kIsIJ
Good luck guessing my shit.
Yeah I thought about adding a note that it’s pretty outdated - and dictionary based scans were always possible even if less common in the old days - like those infamous passwords “God”, “Love”, “secret”, or like “admin”.
The artist is pretty smart most of the time though so I presume they were aware of that possibility and meant that on a more basic level there are multiple ways to make passwords easier for a user to remember, not necessarily just this one rather simplistic take but as part of a whole approach. Then again, they didn’t say that, and instead said this, thus the controversy.
Personally I gave up entirely and now I don’t even know what any of my own passwords are, though my password manager does:-). I guess… if you cannot beat them, join them!?:-P
My current favorite “memorizable” method (obviously a random hash from a PW manager is still better) is to take a sentence of moderate complexity that includes the name of the service you’re signing up for in it, and use the first letter of each word as your password.
For example, “When I wake up in the morning, the first thing I do is go to pawb.social.”
Password would be “WIwuitm,tftIdigtps.”
Easy to remember, immune to dictionary attacks, and you get a (mostly) unique password for each service, so stolen passwords can only access that one thing.
Edit: To be clear, the value is that you can use the same sentence everywhere, switching out the name of the service to generate semi-unique passwords for each service. Obviously someone analyzing your passwords would be able to figure out the pattern, but that’s basically never what actually happens; it’s more likely someone gets 1 password and tries your email address + that PW in a variety of services, which this is strong against.
It’s surprisingly easy to memorize. The sentence basically acts as a mnemonic device to remember the password, and it’s a lot easier to memorize a sentence that makes sense to you than to memorize something like “Tr0ub4d0r&8”.
I dunno, all I do is hit copy, then go to the website and hit paste, and that’s pretty easy as well:-P.
I do need to step up my game for work though, b/c it keeps asking me a password multiple times a day so if I could rattle one off that would be better than having to open up my password manager and get it.
The rainbow table would have to include every four word combination. At around half a million words in the English dictionary, that’s not a small number.
As another XKCD comic illustrates, it’s cheaper to use a wrench.
Dictionary attacks have been around for a long time, but It’s still quite strong especially if you throw in a number.
A fully random 8 character password has about 10^14 brute force combinations (assuming upper and lower case + the normal special characters). 4 words choosen at random from the top 3000 words (which is a very small vocabulary really) is 10^13 dictionary attack combinations, add a single number or account for variations in word style (I.e maybe don’t always use camel case) and you’ve matched the difficulty. If you use 5 words it’s 10^17 combinations.
A password manager and a hard password is a better idea but there are cases where you can’t use a password manager (like the password to said manager).
This could actually work though lol, it’s genius
Find a good password here 😏
I suspect if the cracking code was constructed such that it had more weight on trying combinations of common words then this would be much easier to crack
I would naively think that as well - you would expand your alphabet of “symbols” to include both single letters and numbers and punctuation but also common words as well. It is still a lot of combinations to have to try though, even if less than each letter by itself.
Example of what My passwords are like :
%*7EfOLkN@6AP28!8Dl#
or potentially if allowed :
W@c2wYnN9J3xGcyc47#ZkHJvt&Hm%q&Ad0b&Xwz#jnl4Th%6UBexD16a$YBFc@svnVrCBxXP0EpwLp6%Gk*Lom%@Qq#DjY1zsf0CzIrHHqPc8gt4edDVsg!omj*kIsIJ
Good luck guessing my shit.
Amateur! Strong enough passwords are like:
ÕÚüd¸2stb½õ~jëv×Â/oyÓh²î´t¶»Ö°ÍðoNVRïé2Wc4'H,CâÞó_ökÅ,Kð¡X9ÄÀ.þTØÓoæ73d*ëÞ¢?²i"`צeÉçß,ÎÅëüS.¹([)ãÒÑêf9÷¿¢=@Á×ÅQÎÂßu¸Å(iRZµîw&ãR
That’s the stupidest combination I’ve ever heard in my life! That’s the kinda thing an idiot would have on his luggage!
You fool, you utter buffoon -
This is what a strong enough password looks like
https://youtu.be/Udf44K6rt-E?si=NarzUUr0YLNEhtxi
Try this on for size :
`'�d+�t<�5mF�qrqcmv/�F��~��Yv�Om�/lK�RɏY%ɺP1�h�Ryl-�G/��m�ʰ�+^)��<>�itdkaz�q2HA*1�PK�D@{9�vN.<}�~ٕ�_�26IA/cHIn����1ĈҾܒl�I9$�vA��W¸ȶW"z�}θ�x�,>~�Ux�SJZ\�5ÀI��F}nLZT�;KӚq�&NQo32y7���0"^LÎs>��j!��V��k��2O<2W�ƽYcA#8�J�Of�pهZb�%1g�w�!k*h(ʶ73�@�CC�hUsԺe!_��dR�ٞpvG|.=4{v"&.��m=_�͚DZZף�aaZ��Cq�!sG1T3�=2lb,����^�镰n)Ld]��
What’s my power level now?
You lever is very low! There are not displayable characters so you cannot easly verity the password by eye or copy from paper.
Why would I have to verify by eye? That’s what a password manager is for. And writing your passwords on paper? ಠ益ಠ
Sometimes you have to give a password to a friend on a paper or by a phone.
Password for what? The Netflix I don’t have? 🏴☠️🦜
#ENHANCE
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Entropy so strong it makes quantum computers cry.
Also :
Rainbow tables and presumably newer stuff I haven’t heard of make this sort of thing weaker than it used to be
How does a rainbow table help here? They’re more for decoding unsalted encrypted database tables, rather than for actually trying to login.
Yeah I thought about adding a note that it’s pretty outdated - and dictionary based scans were always possible even if less common in the old days - like those infamous passwords “God”, “Love”, “secret”, or like “admin”.
The artist is pretty smart most of the time though so I presume they were aware of that possibility and meant that on a more basic level there are multiple ways to make passwords easier for a user to remember, not necessarily just this one rather simplistic take but as part of a whole approach. Then again, they didn’t say that, and instead said this, thus the controversy.
Personally I gave up entirely and now I don’t even know what any of my own passwords are, though my password manager does:-). I guess… if you cannot beat them, join them!?:-P
It’s it outdated at all, but you need more words.
See diceware, 7 to 8 words fed typically all you need
My current favorite “memorizable” method (obviously a random hash from a PW manager is still better) is to take a sentence of moderate complexity that includes the name of the service you’re signing up for in it, and use the first letter of each word as your password.
For example, “When I wake up in the morning, the first thing I do is go to pawb.social.”
Password would be “WIwuitm,tftIdigtps.”
Easy to remember, immune to dictionary attacks, and you get a (mostly) unique password for each service, so stolen passwords can only access that one thing.
Edit: To be clear, the value is that you can use the same sentence everywhere, switching out the name of the service to generate semi-unique passwords for each service. Obviously someone analyzing your passwords would be able to figure out the pattern, but that’s basically never what actually happens; it’s more likely someone gets 1 password and tries your email address + that PW in a variety of services, which this is strong against.
I simply change my keyboard layout. Auto-scramble a simple phrase.
This seems like a memory method for someone who has a great memory. (Better than mine anyway)
It’s surprisingly easy to memorize. The sentence basically acts as a mnemonic device to remember the password, and it’s a lot easier to memorize a sentence that makes sense to you than to memorize something like “Tr0ub4d0r&8”.
I dunno, all I do is hit copy, then go to the website and hit paste, and that’s pretty easy as well:-P.
I do need to step up my game for work though, b/c it keeps asking me a password multiple times a day so if I could rattle one off that would be better than having to open up my password manager and get it.
The rainbow table would have to include every four word combination. At around half a million words in the English dictionary, that’s not a small number.
As another XKCD comic illustrates, it’s cheaper to use a wrench.
Salting makes rainbow tables pretty much useless, and salting has been a standard practise for a few decades now.
A few? I always had an easy time cracking my mom’s desktop password with them so I guess Microsoft wasn’t doing it with XP or Vista.
Just to give you some opposite example, WordPress, Magento, Drupal, Django are using salts almost 2 decades now.
You do realize XP and Vista are few decades old?
Dictionary attacks have been around for a long time, but It’s still quite strong especially if you throw in a number.
A fully random 8 character password has about 10^14 brute force combinations (assuming upper and lower case + the normal special characters). 4 words choosen at random from the top 3000 words (which is a very small vocabulary really) is 10^13 dictionary attack combinations, add a single number or account for variations in word style (I.e maybe don’t always use camel case) and you’ve matched the difficulty. If you use 5 words it’s 10^17 combinations.
A password manager and a hard password is a better idea but there are cases where you can’t use a password manager (like the password to said manager).
I’m a basic little shit so, I basically use a correct horse + number password for my PW manager
I use a whole sentence with a typo lol
Something like "On March the 3rd of 2012 my dog Billy ate 8€ worrth of schmeggles!“
Used beginning letters of the words in song verse sprinkled with special characters for the rythm, feels good while typing