I see, so your argument now is new evidence is pointless. Therefore information from thousands of years ago is true regardless of new info. I guess gravity is f=ma and the theory of relativity is pretend because it doesn’t fit your timeline.

Here’s a quote from the article.

China is also on track to miss its 2020–25 goal of cutting carbon intensity

I mean if your not even going to read the article, I’m not going to respond any further.

And that’s what I responded to. China is now surpassing their goals. It did take them a while to start actually decreasing, but they’re doing it now. But if you look back even a few years ago, they were missing it. I’m not saying the information the OP posted is wrong. Only, it’s now changed so rapidly they’re going to hit their targets even though as he points out, they missed it in the period of 2020 - 2025.

That’s worded weird. It’s because they only started decreasing emissions in the last year. So using the 4 years prior to the last year or 2020-2024, of course they missed it. It’s like if you just bought a car and someone came and said well for the 4 years prior you didn’t have a car, so you’re not a car owner.

That’s the amazing thing about China, you blink and your info is out of date. China’s emissions have peaked and are going down now. Way before the promised 2035 deadline from your post. China under promised and over delivered. Let me guess, your response will start at but at what cost?

https://www.nationalheraldindia.com/environment/ahead-of-cop30-china-shows-the-way-co-emissions-flatten-for-18-months-renewables-surge

Yeah, but who wasn’t doing that to the Philippines? I mean the US was definitely doing that.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us-told-philippines-it-made-missteps-secret-anti-vax-propaganda-effort-2024-07-26/

Ultimately what I would take from all of this is on hardware China is close. Not at NVIDIA chips yet, but without software optimization, it doesn’t matter how close the hardware is. Imo what China is doing right now is to force a criticality in number of users to find bugs and optimize the software. It’s literally the only way they can catch up. What’s hilarious is Lutnick literally told them this.

And to prove my point, just look at MooreThread S80. When it first released it had the hardware but ran so poorly it ran like a GTX1030. But with software optimization, it could run wukong at 48fps at 4k. Without the users, China can’t improve. So now they’re forcing people to be users.

Probably. It’s hard to say since so much is behind the veil. In fact it’s likely China has its own DUV lithography supply. US estimates on what China can produced based on number of asml units sold is wildly wrong.

It’s actually funny that you’re asking that. This is exactly Huawei’s solution.

https://semianalysis.com/2025/04/16/huawei-ai-cloudmatrix-384-chinas-answer-to-nvidia-gb200-nvl72/

I don’t think you realize it, but your proving my point. I never said no Huawei chips would be sold. I said China wants to reach criticality with it’s users. With Huawei chips being more expensive and less capable, the big boys won’t buy Huawei. And the secondary market doesn’t matter to the big boys who will get it at MSRP because orders always go to them first. Since they have the most users and will have the most exposure for stress testing.

The last thing China wants is for Huawei to only sell to smaller companies and start ups where it’s entirely possible there will be no users and money wasted. That’s why the new law only targets the major companies.

*Edit on that point I’m going to predict the future now. In a few months we’re going to see an article saying China has bought record amounts of H20s and NVIDIA’s stocks are going to go up again. This is because the smaller companies are still going to be buying and at MSRP because the big boys can’t.

Here’s an article about what I am saying. I don’t think there are benchmarks though.

https://www.theregister.com/2025/07/29/huawei_rackscale_boogeyman/#%3A~%3Atext=While+the+H20+still+holds+a+narrow+advantage%2Cat+least+so+far+as+inference+is+concerned.

The problem is the Chinese chips are not cheaper. Huawei’s 910c is about 30% slower and 1/3 more expensive. Add on top of that a lack of software, without government force, who would buy it?

They did, but you’re not understanding what’s being said. The H20 is a crippled chip that NVIDIA made for the Chinese market because of US sanctions. This chip is about 50% slower than NVIDIA’s latest Blackwell B200 chip. China is saying the caught up to the crippled version. Which is true, they have not however caught up to the latest and greatest. They haven’t even caught up to the non-crippled version the H100 which the poster below mentions.

You’re right about that, BUT I’d argue that’s all small potatoes. If no one develops on Chinese chips, then they’ll never actually be competitive. The only way for China to push ahead in any capacity, or even to catch up is to have thousands of users on their chipsets.

Let’s look at the MooreThreads MTT80. When it started it was performing like a 2017 GPU GT1030. They did 0 hardware upgrades. I will repeat that 0 hardware upgrades. But today, it’s able to run the domestic game Black Myth WuKong at 4k at 40 fps. Yes I realize that means it stutters, but with no hardware changes they were able to make a fairly demanding modern game playable. What this has rang through out China I am sure is, China has to do everything on earth to fix their software. If that means banning NVIDIA, so be it.

Exactly right! This why China is banning the chips. They caught up in hardware and now need to catch up in software. If they continue to allow people to use NVIDIA chips, then their software will never progress as they won’t have users to optimize them.

Probably that’s because that’s exactly what this is? They’re watching a parade having a beer. What did we expect?

Of course not? If they gave you that impression then you would pry. As I said, it’s pretty universal at this point. No mind reading needed. The fact that you were trying to do exactly what they’re trying to avoid is hilarious to me.

This is a tier 4 city in China. Which is far down the development ladder and considered poor.

https://youtu.be/kZon-AlmJbM

The vast majority of Chinese live in cities like this or better. Saying that there are still poor villages, well I give you this

https://youtu.be/fI30F0Vt88E

Kensington Philadelphia is so drug infested people walk around like zombies. Does China have poor areas like that? Actually no, even the poorest villages aren’t that bad.

They refuse to offer criticism to you, they will criticize the CCP constantly amongst themselves. They’ve sadly learned right or wrong that westerners are always trying to make China look bad. It’s largely from western news like BBC. Just look up the phrase China, but at what cost. The most hilarious one I read was China is curing cancer fast, but at what cost.

That’s exactly what China is doing though. This is classic reverse psychology. USA hasn’t even got a single trade deal, this is just China reminding everyone how stupid USA threats are.