They also said they were still committed to Zune and Windows Phone.
They probably weren’t lying then or now, they are committed… for this quarter. When they read the numbers next quarter, well that’s completely unrelated to today’s commitments!
I wish they would let you install windows on them, but then i guess id be buying games on steam not Microsoft store / gamepass
I would be a thousand times happier in a world without consoles. Games are published everywhere, and “consoles” are just prepackaged PCs from Microsoft or Sony for people who do not want to build a PC themselves, and like their peripherals or something.
That’s a odd stance to take. How would you be a thousand times happier if consoles didn’t exist?
Consoles still have their place in gaming and to think otherwise is somewhere ignorant. Just live the best of both worlds like the rest of us and don’t get so wound up!
How would you be a thousand times happier
Because a company wouldn’t get to decide on which hardware I get to play the software I paid for? It’s pretty obvious, really.
What other industries would you find this acceptable? Could a restaurant force you to only eat beans on their locations? Would Coca-Cola be able to demand you only drink their beverage on glass cups? What if you could only watch your favorite basketball team on Sony branded televisions?
Then don’t buy a console? How does your neighbor Bob playing on his Xbox series s affect you at all?
Did I say I was about to destroy every single console in existence, beat up my neighbors or something?
Or did I just say I’d prefer a world without consoles to begin with?
There’s a difference, and it’s not a hard one to spot.
I mean duh, I can make up any strawman I want and say “there’s a difference”.
No one said that you wanted to commit console genocide, just that your neighbors Xbox is none of your business and you really ought to take a chill pill and game how you please.
I’m about to blow your mind…
You get to decide.
You decide where to (or not to) buy and play the games you want. Like I said there is no requirement to stick to 1 platform and you honestly sound so wound up by this opinion I’m astounded.
lol “you get to decide not to buy the game!” is an argument just like “if you don’t like this political decision, just leave!” is an argument.
Technically yes, yet so dumb and shallow it won’t get your very far.
We’re talking video games here. Nothing else.
Oh thanks for informing me, I was under the impression this conversation was about the conflicts regarding taxes on tea exports.
Or perhaps the conversation was about videogames, but analogies can be used to explain flaws in arguments regardless of direct context.
Guess we will never know which option is true!
That is the most ridiculous straw man argument I’ve never heard
You live in a country you are invested in a country which is why leaving it is so difficult. You’re talking about just not buying a console, it’s the difference between altering a way of life that is being fine up until now versus not getting engaged in one in the first place.
It’s completely different.
I would be a thousand times happier in a world without consoles. Games are published everywhere, and “consoles” are just prepackaged PCs from Microsoft or Sony for people who do not want to build a PC themselves
What do you think current PS and Xbox consoles are? They are all just PC hardware with each a custom OS as differentiating feature. A world in which everything has to run Windows is definitively much worse than the current state.
What do you think current PS and Xbox consoles are? They are all just PC hardware with each a custom OS
Your definition is missing the crucial aspect of forced exclusives and locked down platform.
A world in which everything has to run Windows
Ah yes, as we all know, any gaming PC needs to run Windows, specially if turned into a console form factor. The Steam Deck, famously, runs on Windows 10.
Having been predominantly a PC gamer for 30 years… PCs more hassle to update and maintain. When I finish work I want to sit on my sofa and play with as little inconvenience as possible.
Consoles fit nicely in a living room and are better for local multiplayer. This generation they were also cheaper than buying the equivalent PC hardware at launch.
PCs more hassle to update and maintain.
That’s Windows, not PCs in general. Steam Deck is an example of a PC system done right where the OS just works and tinkering is optional.
I mean desktop, wouldn’t really class the Deck as a PC.
Been tempted to get one but I use the Switch or cloud gaming on the go so have most bases covered already.
And I meant that the majority of “PC maintenance” originates from Windows. Tasks like dust removal from cooling vents isn’t a daily thing (and applies to consoles just the same).
True, but if I’m spending thousands on a machine, I tend to want to be able to do other things on it so unfortunately Windows usually enters the equation.
Will consider a dedicated SteamOS box when I next refresh.
True, but if I’m spending thousands on a machine, I tend to want to be able to do other things on it so unfortunately Windows usually enters the equation.
Then it’s still Windows maintenance, not PC maintenance. For Intel and AMD GPUs, any regular convenience Linux distribution (like Fedora) works with negligible maintenance. It’s only those NVidia users or people who feel the urge to tweak everything steer themselves into maintenance hell.
Surely you still have to update drivers and OS?!
I dual boot Linux on my PC and run it on Raspberry Pis. Let’s not pretend it requires zero maintenance.
The Steam Deck IS a PC though. You can install SteamOS on your computer if you wanted to.
For the purpose of the argument the other user was making, it is functionally similar enough to consoles that it doesn’t feel like a PC, unless you want it to. So really, it suits everyone.
Not to mention that it is literally a PC. It even has a full desktop environment mode running KDE.
You are correct by the technical definition, I apologise for suggesting the Steam Deck as a PC lol.
What sort of things do you run on yours? I’d have thought it being a handheld it wouldn’t be that useful for anything I’d want to run on it as it wouldn’t be always on or connected.
My preference is a dedicated desktop box I can upgrade and potentially run some services like DNS, PiHole and some automated scripts on. I’d rather spend the money on that and keep using the Switch or cloud gaming when I’m on the go.
Yes hence why I corrected to desktop. Sorry, just always used to using PC and desktop as interchangeable terms but see why you’d want to differentiate these days.
My point is I don’t want a handheld that I have to plug in. I prefer a desktop box so although the Deck is great, it doesn’t suit literally all use cases lol.
When I finish work I want to sit on my sofa and play
Nowadays I work from home, and I agree - I don’t want to sit on my desk after a long day of sitting on my desk. Guess what though, I don’t have to, even when using a PC. My Steam Deck allows me to play everywhere, and with a single cable it connects to my TV and I’m playing.
But what if the game is too heavy for the Deck, or I want the ray tracing and 120 FPS of my expensive gaming PC? I just turn on my TV, I choose the Moonlight app, and I click play. That’s it. My computer automatically opens Steam Big Picture, everything is already updated, I grab my controller and I’m gaming. In fact, I would bet a beer or lunch that I can boot a game on my setup faster than a Xbox Series console, if we are both launching a game for the first time rather than resuming from suspend.
How is the latency in moonlight? Thinking about trying it
Latency in Moonlight is extremely dependant on your setup. Most people are aware of having a good connection, preferably with both client and host using CAT6 cable. But you also need a good encoder and decoder.
For instance, using my GTX 1660 Super as the encoding GPU and my Snapdragon 888 Android phone as the decoding device, I had 14 Ms of latency.
Using my RTX 4060 Ti as the encoding GPU and my LG C1 HEVC decoder, the latency is 8 ms.
Using the same RTX GPU as the encoder, but my Steam Deck as the decoder, latency is 2 ms. Or in other words, so fast I can’t even notice it’s streaming and not native.
It’s definitely worth trying out, even at 8 ms on my TV this is faster than the delay a regular old Xbox controller would have, and the quality is impressively good.
Ok but most of my games use Quick Resume so I am playing in under 15 seconds. To be honest the Switch has taken the crown for picking up where you left off since 2017.
I’ve used Moonlight but prefer not to stream really. Would be interested in how the latency is these days.
In the past I’d have said PC all the way but these days I’m glad both options exist. Biggest draw to the PC for me is mods. Would be tempted to make a dedicated SteamOS box next gen.
Ok but most of my games use Quick Resume so I am playing in under 15 seconds.
I just timed my setup, takes 35 seconds to boot my most recently played Steam game. So yes, double your time… But also less than a minute, less than what it takes me to take a glass of water or something.
Would be interested in how the latency is these days.
It varies a lot depending on the setup, some can be quite bad. Mine is got 8 ms of latency. Considering the Xbox Series controller operates at 20 ms of input latency, I don’t see that as a major issue.
Would be tempted to make a dedicated SteamOS box next gen.
There’s a loooot of fun to be had in building small form factor PCs nowadays. Unlike a decade ago, you can now find really nice cases, very low profile coolers, and GPU models that are very thermally efficient. Though again, with a cheap CAT6 cable, you can also just build a thin client to decode Moonlight for you and you won’t even know it’s streaming - things improved a lot recently.
I’d rather see consoles open up to being general purpose PCs, than not see consoles at all.
Valve got it right with the Steam Deck. I enjoy accessing my game library from SteamOS and using the Desktop Mode when I need to be productive.
If the Xbox had an option to boot into Windows, they’d be selling the Xbox like hot cakes. It would keep users invested in Windows as a platform rather than them moving to Linux or macOS. It’s such a waste of potential.
They’re far too stupid to realize that.
open up to being general purpose PCs, than not see consoles at all.
That’s what I said though. Looking at the reactions I got here, unpopular opinion, people prefer consoles to be entirely locked down, have exclusives and zero access to game files.
As always, it’s a trade-off between convenience and ability to tweak.
When it comes to gaming, the convenience slightly edges it for me at the mo. Enjoying Game Pass, play anywhere, Quick Resume and have made all the money back I spent on the Series X through Microsoft Rewards twice over.
Next upgrade will be a tough call though.
Yeah I probably would never have even gotten into gaming if it weren’t for consoles. PC games are fun, but gaming on a PC is not for everybody.
I agree in the context of a N64, a PlayStation 2, a Super Nintendo.
I’d be very surprised if playing in an Xbox Series X is somehow transformative for a child growing up today, compared to playing the same games on a PC. But I’m open to any argument explaining the difference.
It’s never a good sign when you have to say something like that…
“Any man who must say ‘I am the King’ is no true king.”
Didn’t Aragorn have to tell those ghost dudes he was the king to get them to fulfill their oath? 🤔
Yeah, and it went something like “Hay, I am TEH KING” Ghost dudes be like “lolwut? Fuq, die bitch” Aragorn blocks attack with Anduril “Oh shit, lmao, sorry, we gotchu bruh”
THEN he was teh kang.
They should make Linux boxes.
Xbox is Microsoft so that’ll literally never happen. They could make Windows 11 boxes though.
Xbox is Microsoft so that’ll literally never happen.
Microsoft already uses Linux and in fact even develops its own Linux distribution since quite some time because Windows just isn’t good enough for certain tasks: https://github.com/microsoft/CBL-Mariner
Surface Duo is another Linux-based product by Microsoft.
Surface Duo uses Android though so I wouldn’t put it in the same vein as Linux distros. Microsoft uses Linux for their web services like everyone else, but there is no way they’re going to push people to using their competitor on consumer products. They want people to stay on Windows.
Surface Duo uses Android though
Android is Linux.
here is no way they’re going to push people to using their competitor on consumer products. They want people to stay on Windows.
Windows Phone is dead, Android is not.
One of the reasons that Steam Deck is better than Windows handheld PCs is because Valve can freely modify the graphics drivers. That’s not possible with the proprietary Windows Radeon drivers.
Android is Linux
Yes and no
Only yes. GNU software is irrelevant for anything being Linux (lots of other Linux distributions use no GNU software at all, most notably embedded variants using musl and Busybox). The kernel being a modified one is also irrelevant because almost every distribution ships patches to the kernel. The only person who can revoke Android being Linux is Linus Torvalds, not some random YouTuber named Gary.
Fact is, Microsoft ships Linux-based products and even if it’s highly unlikely what they will switch the Xbox business to release Linux hardware, the outright statement “that’ll literally never happen” is ignorant.
True, I was just nit-picking rather than disagreeing with your original statement
The only reason they want their games on multiple platforms is so they can prove they’re not trying to buy up studios for exclusivity. This is the main objective here folks. They don’t care about being on more than one platform, they just don’t want to fight the FTC again when they try to buy up sega, square enix, take2, embracer or whoever the fuck they want to buy next. Remember, this is the same arrogant bullshit company that wanted to buy Nintendo and got laughed out of the conference room.
The writing is on the wall here, and it’s plain to see. Also, you really can’t trust anything that comes out of Phil Spencer’s mouth.
If the goal is indeed for Xbox games to be on all platforms, then the Xbox platform is the only place they don’t make money. Super low third-party sales, zero first-party sales. Only gamepass subscription money, which can’t pay for all of their company buyouts, never mind paying off the 65 billion actiblizz purchase.
If gamepass is everywhere, then Xbox has no value to Microsoft, it only harms them.
It also exists to weaken any argument they might have to get governments to forcibly allow Microsoft stores on other platforms like the eu apple ruling.
It doesn’t even matter if Gamepass or Xbox is currently profitable or not. It’s about whether it can be more profitable. They originally thought the path to that was through exclusivity - now they don’t (just as Sony changed course in regards to putting stuff on PC). Anyone who thinks that corporate decision-making is ever based on anything else is being naive.
The practical concern here for me is at what point does MS find it most profitable to stop supporting my ability to use my accumulated physical and digital xbox software. Another reason walled gardens suck.
Windows is everywhere but the Microsoft Surface products still have value to Microsoft. Or for that matter, Steam is everywhere but Valve still made the steam deck. There seems to be some value to software companies making hardware if only to help set the tone and introduce features or ideas they hope other companies who use their software will follow.
That said, I wonder if we won’t see the Xbox brand transition to software only with a line of gamer targeted Microsoft surfaces advertised as Xbox ready.
Those are the standards and those products have value. Buying an Xbox when Playstation has all games for both consoles makes no sense unless you just have to have Gamepass, specifically.
It’s almost as if Microsoft is a software company at heart and just wants to sell as many copies of their software as possible.
Also, you really can’t trust anything that comes out of Phil Spencer’s mouth.
That’s really not a Phil Spencer thing, and more of a “You can tell any executive is lying, because their lips are moving” thing.
When a nintendo executive I generally trust that theirs truth somewhere past the branding. With Phil Spencer talks I’m just assuming the opposite of everything he says. It’s a different thing, he really goes for the lies, to you, to the ftc, everyone
Satoru Iwata said they don’t do layoffs, he even took pay cuts to attempt to balance their budgets and keep people on…then he died in 2015. Now Nintendo’s credibility is in the toilet with the rest. The mistake you’re making is trusting a company with shareholders, you really need to learn how this works…executives of publicly traded companies=fucking liars.
Microsoft with gamepass (and other large game companies) are trying to do the gaming industry what Spotify did to the music industry. Blow the bottom out of it, get consumers used to subscriptions where money goes to massive companies not the artists actually doing the work, and let it all collapse into a heap so execs can do whatever they want because workers in the game industry have zero leverage left to dictate a higher quality of life since the path to profit has been carpet bombed by the finance industry (you don’t want to work for Microsoft or Sony? Oh sorry yeah nobody else can make money in video games so tough luck finding a job somewhere else).
Why now? Well unlike the movie industry, video game nerds have a stunted awareness of the value of unions and worker organization so in plain daylight the rich can drive the entire industry off a cliff, fire a huge percentage of the workers and try to replace them with AI… and worst comes to worst those companies will be in a great position to demand whatever they want from the remaining human labor after the dust settles even if the AI crap doesn’t work.
Good old Disaster Capitalism.
Okay, but are the users still committed to buying them?
I mean, is that a real problem for Microsoft today?
I think Xbox is in its stronger times, so much that I actually want one lol
Considering that estimates have PS5 outselling XSeries by 2:1 (also confirmed by semi-official data), and XSeries doing worse than its predecessor, I’d say: yes, it’s a very real problem for them.
I hope they truly stick with the Xbox brand, it will be bad for all of us to only have Sony with the cake… (I mean we have Nintendo, but they have always been on their own).
